Original Usenet thread from alt.ascii-art, started 10 Feb 2001.
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All YOUR Romantic Needs - Relationship101.com 9857
alt.ascii-art
· 67 messages · 10 Feb 2001 - 13 Mar 2001
<ejm...@Relationship101.com> wrote in message news:Auah6.62330$t94...@news1.rdc1.bc.home.com... > For all your Love, Sex, & Relationship needs..... > > Needs? All I need is a woman, knee pads, and a getaway car. On "special" nights, I can do without the woman. Dale "Lowthario Donkey Juan Casanoodle" Houstman
Anyone know why the subject of so much spam contains a 4 digit number? I'm tempted to set it as a filtering system. Stuart
"Stuart Moore" <stu...@bigfoot.com> writes: > Anyone know why the subject of so much spam contains a 4 digit number? It appears that it's supposed to evade cancelbots and spamfilters that search for a: certain subjectlines and b: messages with the same subject etc. being posted multiple times... Seems like certain SpamWare inserts those automatically... Like in: "Spam is Great!!!1 4242" is a different subject than "Spam is Great!!!1 1313". How smart/effective that is is another thing alltogether - most better filters seem to get rid of the crap nonetheless... > I'm tempted to set it as a filtering system. Interesting idea... never thought about something like that myself, since my newsserver[1] uses excellent filtering etc., but it might work. Maybe not as the only criterion - four-digit numbers aren't all *that* uncommon, but as one of several indicators it should be pretty safe. Tilman ---------- [1] More or less publicly funded. Definetely better than pretty much any of the ISP-or otherwise commercially-run newsservers over here. *Far* better. Free to use. One more example that "prvatize everything! Rigth now! Totally" is straight and utter bullshit. Whatever, I'm starting to rant again... -- ,--------------------------------------------------------. |Tilman Ahr | Email: rio...@gmx.net | | | til...@student.hu-berlin.de | `--------------------------PGP-Key available by request--�
> > Anyone know why the subject of so much spam contains a 4 digit number? > > It appears that it's supposed to evade cancelbots and spamfilters that > search for a: certain subjectlines and b: messages with the same subject > etc. being posted multiple times... Seems like certain SpamWare inserts > those automatically... I'd like to see a good spamfilter that can get around these cable box ads we see. You know, f.r-e=e..c-a^b.l;e' and the like. > [1] More or less publicly funded. Definetely better than pretty much any > of the ISP-or otherwise commercially-run newsservers over here. *Far* > better. Free to use. And the address to this server is......? -- ________________________________________________________ | . . | _____ | | _ _ _|_ _ _| _ _ | C64/C128- _///@@@| | | |/ \'_| | / \ / |'_| / ` | What's /'//ZZ@@|____ | | | |/ | | L-'| |/ || | *YOUR* |'''/ |'/@7 | | | |\_|_\_\_. \_|\_|_\_. | hobby? |`'| `~~' | | _ . . `-----------. | `| .--. | | /_\ | _ _ _ |_ | _ _ _ ._ _ | | `\____|___\ | | |(_Y |/(_`/ `'_|| \|/_) / `/ \| | | | \_ | | | \_. |\._)\_.(_||_/|\_. O \_.\_/| | | | \_____| | `---------------------------------------"----------------'
Nate / DAC <nos...@nospam.com> writes: > I'd like to see a good spamfilter that can get around these cable box > ads we see. You know, f.r-e=e..c-a^b.l;e' and the like. Oh? They're still around? Haven't seen one for months ;-) > And the address to this server is......? news.cis.dfn.de Doesn't carry binary-groups, filters binary posts (most of 'em, anyway), requires registration via e-mail, has a somewhat "strict" aup (no cmessages except to cancel your own articles, use of realname, valid mail-adress, rfc-conformant posts). Also features an abuse-team from hell ;-)) See http://news.cis.dfn.de/ for more info. Tilman -- ,--------------------------------------------------------. |Tilman Ahr | Email: rio...@gmx.net | | | til...@student.hu-berlin.de | `--------------------------PGP-Key available by request--�
> > And the address to this server is......? > news.cis.dfn.de > > Doesn't carry binary-groups, filters binary posts (most of 'em, anyway), > requires registration via e-mail, has a somewhat "strict" aup (no > cmessages except to cancel your own articles, use of realname, valid > mail-adress, rfc-conformant posts). Well dang it... at least the ability to hide my Email address would be nice, and there is at least one binaries group that I watch (usually dead anyways). The other restrictions don't bother me, though. Ah well, guess I'll keep my existing server. Its only problem is that it's got to be the slowest news server in existance - even over a 33.6k dialup off my Commodore 128, my previous ISP's news server was several times faster. Ahh well, small price to pay for cablemodem speed :-) I'm constantly waiting for Pine to finish "formatting scrolltext" or being "[Busy </>]" every time the news server is queried (this is an indication to me that it's waiting for the server to reply...what the hell is scrolltext doing in my Email program anyways?? That belongs in C64 demos, not application software :) -- ________________________________________________________ | . . | _____ | | _ _ _|_ _ _| _ _ | C64/C128- _///@@@| | | |/ \'_| | / \ / |'_| / ` | What's /'//ZZ@@|____ | | | |/ | | L-'| |/ || | *YOUR* |'''/ |'/@7 | | | |\_|_\_\_. \_|\_|_\_. | hobby? |`'| `~~' | | _ . . `-----------. | `| .--. | | /_\ | _ _ _ |_ | _ _ _ ._ _ | | `\____|___\ | | |(_Y |/(_`/ `'_|| \|/_) / `/ \| | | | \_ | | | \_. |\._)\_.(_||_/|\_. O \_.\_/| | | | \_____| | `---------------------------------------"----------------'
--(Once apon a time, in alt.ascii-art,)-- --(Nate / DAC said it like only they can.)-- > >I'd like to see a good spamfilter that can get around these cable box ads >we see. You know, f.r-e=e..c-a^b.l;e' and the like. > we have been covering things like this in news.software.readers but on slrn you can do it this way [*] Score:: -9999 Subject: p.?h.?e.?r.?m.?o.?n.?e.?s Subject: A.?P.?H.?R.?O.?D.?I.?S.?I.?A.?C Subject: A.?T.?T.?R.?A.?C.?T Score: -9999 Subject: Q.?U.?I.?T Subject: S.?M.?O.?K.?I.?N.?G Score: -9999 Subject: f.?r.?e.?e.? Subject: c.?a.?b.?l.?e not only will these let you kill f`r.e,*e c-a=b+l_e.? but theye will kill fr.e,*e c-a=bl_e.? this is needed because some spammers have clued into people killing [a-z][^a-z] patters so started spicing there headers up by putting at least two [a-z]'s together -- --(UIN=66618055)-- --(tty1@faux.local_04:45_/home/faux)-- cat .sig GUI's are for slackers. ibpconf.sh 6 on freshmeat.net The easiest way to customize the command line. By Faux_Pseudo
> we have been covering things like this in news.software.readers > > but on slrn you can do it this way > > [*] > Score:: -9999 > Subject: p.?h.?e.?r.?m.?o.?n.?e.?s > Subject: A.?P.?H.?R.?O.?D.?I.?S.?I.?A.?C > Subject: A.?T.?T.?R.?A.?C.?T > Score: -9999 > Subject: Q.?U.?I.?T > Subject: S.?M.?O.?K.?I.?N.?G > Score: -9999 > Subject: f.?r.?e.?e.? > Subject: c.?a.?b.?l.?e > > not only will these let you kill f`r.e,*e c-a=b+l_e.? > but theye will kill fr.e,*e c-a=bl_e.? > this is needed because some spammers have clued into people > killing [a-z][^a-z] patters so started spicing there headers up > by putting at least two [a-z]'s together Yes, I've noticed this too. You'd think spammers could be a little more original though :-) I'll have to browse through Pine's configuration, I'm pretty sure it can route messages through procmail on their way in..... -- ________________________________________________________ | . . | _____ | | _ _ _|_ _ _| _ _ | C64/C128- _///@@@| | | |/ \'_| | / \ / |'_| / ` | What's /'//ZZ@@|____ | | | |/ | | L-'| |/ || | *YOUR* |'''/ |'/@7 | | | |\_|_\_\_. \_|\_|_\_. | hobby? |`'| `~~' | | _ . . `-----------. | `| .--. | | /_\ | _ _ _ |_ | _ _ _ ._ _ | | `\____|___\ | | |(_Y |/(_`/ `'_|| \|/_) / `/ \| | | | \_ | | | \_. |\._)\_.(_||_/|\_. O \_.\_/| | | | \_____| | `---------------------------------------"----------------'
Nate / DAC <nos...@nospam.com> writes: > Well dang it... at least the ability to hide my Email address would be > nice, Well, tanstaafl, as you're probably aware ;-) But that isn't really an issue IMHO... I, for one just use a freemailer-account with fair spamfiltering that I don't check really often for news. Gets me down to just a few spam-mail per week - an amount I can live with. > and there is at least one binaries group that I watch One could always get those from a different server, of course... > I'm constantly waiting for Pine to finish "formatting scrolltext" or > being "[Busy </>]" every time the news server is queried (this is an > indication to me that it's waiting for the server to reply... Pine? The *nix mailreader? Most people I know seem to agree that it sucks badly for news - but if you don't have a choice... I always recommend Xemacs/gnus, though that's probably a matter of taste... > what the hell is scrolltext doing in my Email program anyways?? That > belongs in C64 demos, not application software :) ACK. Tilman -- ,--------------------------------------------------------. |Tilman Ahr | Email: rio...@gmx.net | | | til...@student.hu-berlin.de | `--------------------------PGP-Key available by request--�
> Well, tanstaafl, as you're probably aware ;-) But that isn't really an [looks in vain for explaination] tanstaafl........Do what? > issue IMHO... I, for one just use a freemailer-account with fair I've never liked those, since they usually require a web interface, with no POP3 or NNTP capabilities (as appropriate). > just a few spam-mail per week - an amount I can live with. Well that's about all I get also, but less is always better. I'm sure it has something to do with the fact that every spam I receive gets forwarded to the most likely address to reach their actual host (most people aren't clever enough to hide all of their information in the header, often there's a valid address in there someplace). Only irritating thing is when you send out an abuse report and you get nothing back, not even an automated response... the mail didn't bounce, but no one reads the abuse reports and acts on them? arrgh.. > Pine? The *nix mailreader? Most people I know seem to agree that it > sucks badly for news - but if you don't have a choice... I do have a choice, since it is my box it's running on. Actually it does a nice job for the most part. It's only when it starts blocking while waiting to talk to the news server, when I'm just there to read my Email lists, that it becomes a problem. The lack of response to ^C doesn't really happen that often (and usually I just want Pine to give up on talking to the news server) > ACK. ACK? NAK. :-) -- ________________________________________________________ | . . | _____ | | _ _ _|_ _ _| _ _ | C64/C128- _///@@@| | | |/ \'_| | / \ / |'_| / ` | What's /'//ZZ@@|____ | | | |/ | | L-'| |/ || | *YOUR* |'''/ |'/@7 | | | |\_|_\_\_. \_|\_|_\_. | hobby? |`'| `~~' | | _ . . `-----------. | `| .--. | | /_\ | _ _ _ |_ | _ _ _ ._ _ | | `\____|___\ | | |(_Y |/(_`/ `'_|| \|/_) / `/ \| | | | \_ | | | \_. |\._)\_.(_||_/|\_. O \_.\_/| | | | \_____| | `---------------------------------------"----------------'
Nate / DAC <nos...@nospam.com> writes: > > Well, tanstaafl, as you're probably aware ;-) But that isn't really an > > [looks in vain for explaination] tanstaafl........Do what? man jargon (or http://tuxedo.org - look for "the jargon file" somewhere - great reading IMHO ... "There Aint No Such Thing As A Free Lunch") > > [freemail-accounts for avoiding spam] > I've never liked those, since they usually require a web interface, with > no POP3 or NNTP capabilities (as appropriate). ? Never ran across one of those myself... I like gmx (http://gmx.net). decent pop server, and even offer smtp (but that service sucks IMO). > > [pine for news] > I do have a choice, since it is my box it's running on. Actually it > does a nice job for the most part. Mhm. I have to use it for mail on my University's shell account (ok, there's always mail, but that's something from the stone ages IMHO), and I *really* miss gnus there... but for news? I don't know. Even tin might be better - and I hate that one... But well, whatever. With software, as with everything, beauty lies in the eye of the beholder... Does pine at least do decent threading by now? That's what *really* put me off in the first place. Tilman, f'up2 /me 'cause this is slowly but surely going *way* OT. -- ,--------------------------------------------------------. |Tilman Ahr | Email: rio...@gmx.net | | | til...@student.hu-berlin.de | `--------------------------PGP-Key available by request--�
On Mon, 12 Feb 2001 00:23:46 GMT, Nate / DAC <nos...@nospam.com> provoked the following text: >> > Anyone know why the subject of so much spam contains a 4 digit number? >> >> It appears that it's supposed to evade cancelbots and spamfilters that >> search for a: certain subjectlines and b: messages with the same subject >> etc. being posted multiple times... Seems like certain SpamWare inserts >> those automatically... > >I'd like to see a good spamfilter that can get around these cable box ads >we see. You know, f.r-e=e..c-a^b.l;e' and the like. The killfile in Forte Agent does a darn great job! Of course, looking at your headers i get no clues about your OS, so i have no idea whether it would run on your machine. -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 792wu/8740hrs You cannot buy hardware of any kind on Sunday. (Virginia state law, Passed in 1975, repealed in 1977)
> The killfile in Forte Agent does a darn great job! > Of course, looking at your headers i get no clues about your OS, so i have no > idea whether it would run on your machine. It's Unix, and as such I use Pine. However I'm sure it's filtering feature can do this also, I've just never bothered to look into it :) -- ________________________________________________________ | . . | _____ | | _ _ _|_ _ _| _ _ | C64/C128- _///@@@| | | |/ \'_| | / \ / |'_| / ` | What's /'//ZZ@@|____ | | | |/ | | L-'| |/ || | *YOUR* |'''/ |'/@7 | | | |\_|_\_\_. \_|\_|_\_. | hobby? |`'| `~~' | | _ . . `-----------. | `| .--. | | /_\ | _ _ _ |_ | _ _ _ ._ _ | | `\____|___\ | | |(_Y |/(_`/ `'_|| \|/_) / `/ \| | | | \_ | | | \_. |\._)\_.(_||_/|\_. O \_.\_/| | | | \_____| | `---------------------------------------"----------------'
On Tue, 13 Feb 2001 07:34:53 GMT, Nate / DAC <nos...@nospam.com> provoked the following text: >> The killfile in Forte Agent does a darn great job! >> Of course, looking at your headers i get no clues about your OS, so i have no >> idea whether it would run on your machine. >It's Unix, and as such I use Pine. However I'm sure it's filtering >feature can do this also, I've just never bothered to look into it :) After reading other of your posts, i even think you are using UNIX 128, is that right? -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 800wu/8740hrs In West Union, Ohio, No married man can go flying without his spouse along at any time, unless he has been married for more than 12 months.
> >> The killfile in Forte Agent does a darn great job! > >> Of course, looking at your headers i get no clues about your OS, so i have no > >> idea whether it would run on your machine. > >It's Unix, and as such I use Pine. However I'm sure it's filtering > >feature can do this also, I've just never bothered to look into it :) > > After reading other of your posts, i even think you are using UNIX 128, is that > right? Nope, it's FreeBSD 4.2, on my PC. As far as I know, that Unix 128 (version 3.0 or something) isn't a Posix system at all, just another unix-like operating system. No multitasking support either. (For that, get JOS :) -- ________________________________________________________ | . . | _____ | | _ _ _|_ _ _| _ _ | C64/C128- _///@@@| | | |/ \'_| | / \ / |'_| / ` | What's /'//ZZ@@|____ | | | |/ | | L-'| |/ || | *YOUR* |'''/ |'/@7 | | | |\_|_\_\_. \_|\_|_\_. | hobby? |`'| `~~' | | _ . . `-----------. | `| .--. | | /_\ | _ _ _ |_ | _ _ _ ._ _ | | `\____|___\ | | |(_Y |/(_`/ `'_|| \|/_) / `/ \| | | | \_ | | | \_. |\._)\_.(_||_/|\_. O \_.\_/| | | | \_____| | `---------------------------------------"----------------'
On Thu, 15 Feb 2001 06:24:24 GMT, Nate / DAC <nos...@nospam.com> provoked the following text: >> >> The killfile in Forte Agent does a darn great job! >> >> Of course, looking at your headers i get no clues about your OS, so i have no >> >> idea whether it would run on your machine. >> >It's Unix, and as such I use Pine. However I'm sure it's filtering >> >feature can do this also, I've just never bothered to look into it :) >> After reading other of your posts, i even think you are using UNIX 128, is that >> right? >Nope, it's FreeBSD 4.2, on my PC. Well, it was close... >As far as I know, that Unix 128 (version 3.0 or something) Unix 128 went to version 3.1, it was dropped by the programmer after that in favor of Sun, UNIX and Vax programming. Pity though, i thought it was a great way to get aquainted with Unix and its variants. >isn't a Posix system at all, just another unix-like operating system. No multitasking >support either. (For that, get JOS :) JOS? Don't know that one. But what i _do_ know is that multitasking is impossible on a C64/128, it could do taskswitching though. However, back when my 128 still worked, i have had a tool that used the processor in whatever floppydrive you had as a copro. All drives you have could be used to that purpose. (but it was advisable to leave 1 drive untouched or you wouldn't have drive access). Something like a rudimentary Breowulf cluster, only slower :-) Hold on, it was not really a tool but a demo, but it came with VisAss sources so that the code could be incorporated in your own code. Alternatively, the program could be called from floppy IIRC. Ah... The C64/128 could have come furter that it already went.... -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 804wu/8740hrs Of all the things I've lost, I miss my mind the most. (O. Osborne)
> >isn't a Posix system at all, just another unix-like operating system. No multitasking > >support either. (For that, get JOS :) > > JOS? Don't know that one. But what i _do_ know is that multitasking is > impossible on a C64/128, it could do taskswitching though. Not at all. A Stock C64 can multitask with LUnix (note the exact spelling). This one is pre-emptive, but I don't know if it's threaded or not, been a while since I last played with it. Very Unix-like. For Super-CPU accellerated machines, JOS does a great job. This one is multi-threaded pre-emptive multitasking. Also very Unix-like. The other night, for example, I as running two GUI interfaces (by accident, I only meant to load one), four shells were open with bitmap soft-80 display drivers, a starfield/warp demo (similar to the windows screensaver), reading a text file as needed, and an IRC client was open. The GUI looks similar to Windows variants, however it's not complete (author has been spending his resources on other parts of the OS). It features a backdrop image (root window, wallpaper, whatever you like to call it), which is a red Ferrari, joystick control for the pointer (with a unique accelleration routine..starts out slow, and speeds up, then slows back down to a stop when you let go...ingenious!), mouse support is coming. Others who have used it report that it can access the Internet (telnet only for now) via the usual PPP over TCP/IP, like any modern PC. What C64/128 can't do (at least, without a hardware addon of some kind) is memory protection, which people seem to think is necessary for Multitasking to occur. All it does is protect programs from each other (fat lot of good it does since the OS usually shuts them down anyway) Now then.....you were saying? :) > However, back when my 128 still worked, i have had a tool that used > the processor in whatever floppydrive you had as a copro. All drives > you have could be used to that purpose. (but it was advisable to leave > 1 drive untouched or you wouldn't have drive access). Something like a > rudimentary Breowulf cluster, only slower :-) Most disk-turbo routines use this capability also, running code inside the drive to take some of the load off the C64 itself. Unfortunately it doesn't apply too well to much outside of, say, compressing data or something. That is, something that involves sending out less data than it takes in, because of how slow the serial bus is. Now if you have a CMD Hard Drive, which offers Parallel, you have a much more powerful "coprocessor" (aside from what the Super CPU does) that just happens to have 64K of RAM, and up to 4 gigs of SCSI-Interfaced mass storage atached to it (up to 96 gigs with custom software), and the possibility to add CD-ROM, ZIP, and other SCSI devices. > Hold on, it was not really a tool but a demo, but it came with VisAss > sources so that the code could be incorporated in your own code. > Alternatively, the program could be called from floppy IIRC. One of my favorite disk drive demos was one that vibrated the drive's head (by rapidly sending signals to the stepper motor) to play simple one-voice music :-) > Ah... The C64/128 could have come furter that it already went.... Believe me, it HAS. See also: Hardware: Creative Micro Designs (Super CPU, RamLink, etc) http://www.cmdweb.com/cbm/index.htm Music: Compute's Gazette SID Collection http://members.xoom.com/cbm_files/music.html Music: High Voltage SID Collection http://home.freeuk.net/wazzaw/HVSC/ Software: Applications, Technical Documents ftp://ftp.funet.fi/pub/cbm Software: Games and Demos ftp://ftp.scs-trc.net/pub/c64 Software: JOS (Unix/X -like multitasking OS, very good) http://www.jolz64.cjb.net/ Software: CLiPS (Windows-like multitasking OS, also very good) http://www.clips64.de Software: Wheels (single-tasking Mac-like OS, official GEOS upgrade) The Wave (Semi-graphical Web Browser) GeoFAX (Fax-modem software for GEOS/Wheels) http://www.ia4u.com/~maurice Books: The Internet for Commodore Users http://cbm.videocam.net.au/tifcu/index.html Documentation: Project 64 http://project64.c64.org Need I say more? :) obascii: ...my signature :) -- ________________________________________________________ | . . | _____ | | _ _ _|_ _ _| _ _ | C64/C128- _///@@@| | | |/ \'_| | / \ / |'_| / ` | What's /'//ZZ@@|____ | | | |/ | | L-'| |/ || | *YOUR* |'''/ |'/@7 | | | |\_|_\_\_. \_|\_|_\_. | hobby? |`'| `~~' | | _ . . `-----------. | `| .--. | | /_\ | _ _ _ |_ | _ _ _ ._ _ | | `\____|___\ | | |(_Y |/(_`/ `'_|| \|/_) / `/ \| | | | \_ | | | \_. |\._)\_.(_||_/|\_. O \_.\_/| | | | \_____| | `---------------------------------------"----------------'
On Fri, 16 Feb 2001 08:39:15 GMT, Nate / DAC <nos...@nospam.com> provoked the following text: >> >isn't a Posix system at all, just another unix-like operating system. No multitasking >> >support either. (For that, get JOS :) >> JOS? Don't know that one. But what i _do_ know is that multitasking is >> impossible on a C64/128, it could do taskswitching though. >Not at all. > >A Stock C64 can multitask with LUnix (note the exact spelling). This one >is pre-emptive, but I don't know if it's threaded or not, been a while >since I last played with it. Very Unix-like. Funny, besides myself you are the only one i have ever seen mentioning LUnix. I have played around a bit with it too. >For Super-CPU accellerated machines, JOS does a great job. This one is >multi-threaded pre-emptive multitasking. Also very Unix-like. > >The other night, for example, I as running two GUI interfaces (by >accident, I only meant to load one), four shells were open with bitmap >soft-80 display drivers, a starfield/warp demo (similar to the windows >screensaver), reading a text file as needed, and an IRC client was open. > >The GUI looks similar to Windows variants, however it's not complete >(author has been spending his resources on other parts of the OS). It >features a backdrop image (root window, wallpaper, whatever you like to >call it), which is a red Ferrari, joystick control for the pointer (with a >unique accelleration routine..starts out slow, and speeds up, then slows >back down to a stop when you let go...ingenious!), mouse support is >coming. Of course, you could use a 1351 mouse in joystick mode. As soon as mouse support is here you can use it in proportional mode as it should. >Others who have used it report that it can access the Internet (telnet >only for now) via the usual PPP over TCP/IP, like any modern PC. COOL!!! I thought that only Novaterm offered TCP/IP. >What C64/128 can't do (at least, without a hardware addon of some kind) is >memory protection, which people seem to think is necessary for >Multitasking to occur. All it does is protect programs from each other >(fat lot of good it does since the OS usually shuts them down anyway) > >Now then.....you were saying? :) Okay, i'll shut up.... :-))) >> However, back when my 128 still worked, i have had a tool that used >> the processor in whatever floppydrive you had as a copro. All drives >> you have could be used to that purpose. (but it was advisable to leave >> 1 drive untouched or you wouldn't have drive access). Something like a >> rudimentary Breowulf cluster, only slower :-) > >Most disk-turbo routines use this capability also, running code inside the >drive to take some of the load off the C64 itself. Unfortunately it >doesn't apply too well to much outside of, say, compressing data or >something. Dunno, i thought it showed great promise. It came with a demo that did a complex calculation in dual CPU mode as well as in single CPU mode. Dual CPU mode was a lot faster, needless to say. >That is, something that involves sending out less data than it takes in, >because of how slow the serial bus is. > >Now if you have a CMD Hard Drive, which offers Parallel, You don't need a CMD drive to have a parallel drive. There were/are kits around that had a flatcable with a socket for one of the chips (can't remember which one, i thionk it was one of the CIA chips) and on the other end it had a userport connector. I think the exact layout must me on the web somewhere. Anyway, with that kit you could have a standard 1541 in parallel mode. >you have a much >more powerful "coprocessor" (aside from what the Super CPU does) that just >happens to have 64K of RAM, and up to 4 gigs of SCSI-Interfaced mass >storage atached to it (up to 96 gigs with custom software), and the >possibility to add CD-ROM, ZIP, and other SCSI devices. I know. >> Hold on, it was not really a tool but a demo, but it came with VisAss >> sources so that the code could be incorporated in your own code. >> Alternatively, the program could be called from floppy IIRC. > >One of my favorite disk drive demos was one that vibrated the drive's head >(by rapidly sending signals to the stepper motor) to play simple one-voice >music :-) I had that one! It came with a number of song, "99 Luftbalons" amongst others. >> Ah... The C64/128 could have come furter that it already went.... >Believe me, it HAS. See also: > >Hardware: Creative Micro Designs (Super CPU, RamLink, etc) >http://www.cmdweb.com/cbm/index.htm I know this site. I have ordered my FD4000 from them. I also have been a subscriber to CW from issue #1 through to #24. >Music: Compute's Gazette SID Collection >http://members.xoom.com/cbm_files/music.html > >Music: High Voltage SID Collection >http://home.freeuk.net/wazzaw/HVSC/ I haven't looked, do you need a SIDSymphony for these tunes? >Software: Applications, Technical Documents >ftp://ftp.funet.fi/pub/cbm One of the best known CBM FTP sites. >Software: JOS (Unix/X -like multitasking OS, very good) >http://www.jolz64.cjb.net/ > >Software: CLiPS (Windows-like multitasking OS, also very good) >http://www.clips64.de > >Software: Wheels (single-tasking Mac-like OS, official GEOS upgrade) > The Wave (Semi-graphical Web Browser) > GeoFAX (Fax-modem software for GEOS/Wheels) >http://www.ia4u.com/~maurice Jos looks appealing and so does Clips. I liked GEOS so i'm sure i'd like Wheels, i already knew GeoFax but this is the first time i have heared of the Wave. Pity they don't show any screenshots... Does it run standalone or does it need GEOS/Wheels? >Books: The Internet for Commodore Users >http://cbm.videocam.net.au/tifcu/index.html Then you wil like this one too, an (offline) HTML browser for the C64: http://hem.passagen.se/harlekin/ >Documentation: Project 64 >http://project64.c64.org Ermm... 404.... >Need I say more? :) Oh, but there is a lot more to be said. As i wrote before, the C64/128 could have come further than it already went. ]My biggest disappointment was that many of these sites haven't been updated in ages. -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 811wu/8740hrs Horses are not to be housed within 50 feet of any road. (Mississippi state law)
> Of course, you could use a 1351 mouse in joystick mode. As soon as mouse support > is here you can use it in proportional mode as it should. Yup. > Dunno, i thought it showed great promise. It came with a demo that did a complex > calculation in dual CPU mode as well as in single CPU mode. Dual CPU mode was a > lot faster, needless to say. Yeah, but with the Super CPU around, it just blows away any of those co-processor ideas :) > >Now if you have a CMD Hard Drive, which offers Parallel, > > You don't need a CMD drive to have a parallel drive. There were/are kits around Certainly not, but the old drives like 1541 only had a couple of K of RAM anyway. However those parallel loaders could, I suppose, also be used in this capacity. > that had a flatcable with a socket for one of the chips (can't remember which > one, i thionk it was one of the CIA chips) and on the other end it had a One of the 6522 VIA's. > userport connector. I think the exact layout must me on the web somewhere. > Anyway, with that kit you could have a standard 1541 in parallel mode. Things like Dolphin-DOS spring to mind. > I had that one! It came with a number of song, "99 Luftbalons" amongst > others. The one I'm thinking of only had one tune, something about "eliza" or so. > >Music: High Voltage SID Collection > >http://home.freeuk.net/wazzaw/HVSC/ > > I haven't looked, do you need a SIDSymphony for these tunes? Nope, but it's nice to have one. It's easy to build, too (CMD no longers sells them, due to lack of good source for SID chips). > Jos looks appealing and so does Clips. I liked GEOS so i'm sure i'd > like Wheels, i already knew GeoFax but this is the first time i have > heared of the Wave. Pity they don't show any screenshots... There are some screenshots of The Wave on Colin Thompson's site I think. Don't have the URL handy, though. > Does it run standalone or does it need GEOS/Wheels? It needs Wheels, a Super CPU with at least 1 MB of RAM, and a high speed modem with Swiftlink-compatible RS232 card. > >Documentation: Project 64 > >http://project64.c64.org > > Ermm... 404.... Strange, I just checked this one before writing the URL. > >Need I say more? :) > > Oh, but there is a lot more to be said. > As i wrote before, the C64/128 could have come further than it already > went. My biggest disappointment was that many of these sites haven't > been updated in ages. True, a lot of the Commodore people get lazy when it comes to thier websites (myself included). Some just don't take the time, though. Either way, there's a lot more to be done before these old machine can rightfully be called 'dead'. So far, the end isn't in sight yet. -- ________________________________________________________ | . . | _____ | | _ _ _|_ _ _| _ _ | C64/C128- _///@@@| | | |/ \'_| | / \ / |'_| / ` | What's /'//ZZ@@|____ | | | |/ | | L-'| |/ || | *YOUR* |'''/ |'/@7 | | | |\_|_\_\_. \_|\_|_\_. | hobby? |`'| `~~' | | _ . . `-----------. | `| .--. | | /_\ | _ _ _ |_ | _ _ _ ._ _ | | `\____|___\ | | |(_Y |/(_`/ `'_|| \|/_) / `/ \| | | | \_ | | | \_. |\._)\_.(_||_/|\_. O \_.\_/| | | | \_____| | `---------------------------------------"----------------'
On Sat, 17 Feb 2001 03:23:01 GMT, Nate / DAC <nos...@nospam.com> provoked the following text: >> Of course, you could use a 1351 mouse in joystick mode. As soon as mouse support >> is here you can use it in proportional mode as it should. >Yup. I thought i'd show you that i'm not totally ignorant when it comes to the commie :-)) >> Dunno, i thought it showed great promise. It came with a demo that did a complex >> calculation in dual CPU mode as well as in single CPU mode. Dual CPU mode was a >> lot faster, needless to say. >Yeah, but with the Super CPU around, it just blows away any of those >co-processor ideas :) You know, i only went as far as the Flash8, contrary to the SCPU it had very little compatibilty. I couldn't get GEOS to run stable, a lot of screens would be f*cked up, both in demos as well as in games. The only programs that really befitted from the Flash8 were Basic programs and a few other programs that just ran faster like a flightsim (don't remember the name) in which you could take off, climb to 40,000 feet and crash in 2 seconds flat :-)) >> >Now if you have a CMD Hard Drive, which offers Parallel, >> You don't need a CMD drive to have a parallel drive. There were/are kits around >Certainly not, Certainly it could! I bought a kit and ran the 1541 in parallel mode for about a year before i retired the good old C64. >but the old drives like 1541 only had a couple of K of RAM >anyway. 2k to be precise. >> that had a flatcable with a socket for one of the chips (can't remember which >> one, i thionk it was one of the CIA chips) and on the other end it had a > >One of the 6522 VIA's. I see i typed CIA. The V and the C are too darn close together! >> I had that one! It came with a number of song, "99 Luftbalons" amongst >> others. >The one I'm thinking of only had one tune, something about "eliza" or so. In that case i think that we are thinking of two different programs. Mine was a program to make these tunes with. >> Jos looks appealing and so does Clips. I liked GEOS so i'm sure i'd >> like Wheels, i already knew GeoFax but this is the first time i have >> heared of the Wave. Pity they don't show any screenshots... >There are some screenshots of The Wave on Colin Thompson's site I >think. Don't have the URL handy, though. Pity. Please post it if you happen to find it. >> Does it run standalone or does it need GEOS/Wheels? >It needs Wheels, a Super CPU with at least 1 MB of RAM, and a high speed >modem with Swiftlink-compatible RS232 card. What ever hapened to Net64? I'm on cable now and if i ever want to internet with the C64 i'll need that one. >> >Documentation: Project 64 >> >http://project64.c64.org >> Ermm... 404.... >Strange, I just checked this one before writing the URL. And when i checked again it was back up. If i ever need docs to the commie i know where to go :-) >> >Need I say more? :) >> Oh, but there is a lot more to be said. >> As i wrote before, the C64/128 could have come further than it already >> went. My biggest disappointment was that many of these sites haven't >> been updated in ages. >True, a lot of the Commodore people get lazy when it comes to thier >websites (myself included). Some just don't take the time, though. I think it's time you go and do you part then! >Either way, there's a lot more to be done before these old machine can >rightfully be called 'dead'. So far, the end isn't in sight yet. I love it to see a true believer like i once was. But i have never declared the commie dead, what i do say is that the scene isn't as vibrant as it once was. For example, the Fairlight site (which C= user never heard of Fairlight?) hasn't been updated since 1997... -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 812wu/8740hrs You're at the end of the road again.
> You know, i only went as far as the Flash8, contrary to the SCPU it had very > little compatibilty. I couldn't get GEOS to run stable, a lot of screens would > be f*cked up, both in demos as well as in games. The only programs that really > befitted from the Flash8 were Basic programs and a few other programs that just > ran faster like a flightsim (don't remember the name) in which you could take > off, climb to 40,000 feet and crash in 2 seconds flat :-)) Flight Simulator II has been patched for Super CPU, as has GEOS. However, most games and demos still screw up, either because they use illegal opcodes that only 6502 variants can execute (65816 doesn't have any illegal ops), or they use 1 MHz-specific timing. Sometimes it's a memory mapping problem, but this, I would think, is extremely rare since the Super CPU only adds a handful of registers to I/O space. > >> >Now if you have a CMD Hard Drive, which offers Parallel, > >> You don't need a CMD drive to have a parallel drive. There were/are kits around > >Certainly not, > > Certainly it could! I bought a kit and ran the 1541 in parallel mode > for about a year before i retired the good old C64. Sorry, my statement came out wrong - the "certainly not" was supposed to enforce your "your dont need..." comment, not reject it. :) > >> I had that one! It came with a number of song, "99 Luftbalons" amongst > >> others. > >The one I'm thinking of only had one tune, something about "eliza" or so. > > In that case i think that we are thinking of two different programs. > Mine was a program to make these tunes with. Ahh, the one I tried didn't have a composer in it, it was just the one tune. "Flowers for Eliza" or something like that? Still, a neat thing to mess with, if you already had a nearly dead 1541 to play around with (I wouldn't want to use that program on a known good drive :) > >> Does it run standalone or does it need GEOS/Wheels? > >It needs Wheels, a Super CPU with at least 1 MB of RAM, and a high speed > >modem with Swiftlink-compatible RS232 card. > > What ever hapened to Net64? I'm on cable now and if i ever want to internet with > the C64 i'll need that one. 64-Net? Well it received a few upgrades, but I don't know the status of it today. I *think* it can use an X1541 cable now (before, it used a parallel/User-Port cable I believe). Last I knew Paul Garners-Stephen was the one in charge, but that was years ago (been a good couple of years since I heard from him last). > And when i checked again it was back up. If i ever need docs to the commie i > know where to go :-) Definitely. Be sure to obtain a copy of the C64 Programmer's Reference Guide sometime, if you ever decide to mess with the C64 again (or with an emulator, such as Vice).. It's an invaluable reference, tells you everything you need to know short of describing the way the signals move about through the machine :) > >True, a lot of the Commodore people get lazy when it comes to thier > >websites (myself included). Some just don't take the time, though. > > I think it's time you go and do you part then! Me? :) Actually my site's not too far out of date, only a few months at worst. However, it probably could use a facelift. > >Either way, there's a lot more to be done before these old machine can > >rightfully be called 'dead'. So far, the end isn't in sight yet. > > I love it to see a true believer like i once was. Curious...why did you give up using it anyways? > But i have never declared the commie dead, what i do say is that the > scene isn't as vibrant as it once was. Agreed... Seems the most activty now is centered in Germany and Poland. If you look at the US Scene just on the serface, it looks flat out dead. But if you dig a little deeper, you'll turn up all kinds of little goodies that we're doing now. One user, Jeri Ellsworth, is working on a VGA card for C64 (I've seen the working prototype). I'm working on an MP3 decoder board wrapped around the MAS3507-D chip (www.micronas.com). Others are pursuing things like better CD-ROM support, multitasking OS's like JOS, Ethernet support, etc. One friend of mine is working on a whole new C64 board - he wants to try to pack the entire board, plus a few enhancements, into a single chip (in VHDL I think). > For example, the Fairlight site (which C= user never heard of Fairlight?) hasn't > been updated since 1997... Fairlight, as a group, hasn't been active at all lately, at least not that I have seen. Crest and Oxyron seem to be the most active right now. I don't know of any NTSC-specific demo groups that are still active. -- ________________________________________________________ | . . | _____ | | _ _ _|_ _ _| _ _ | C64/C128- _///@@@| | | |/ \'_| | / \ / |'_| / ` | What's /'//ZZ@@|____ | | | |/ | | L-'| |/ || | *YOUR* |'''/ |'/@7 | | | |\_|_\_\_. \_|\_|_\_. | hobby? |`'| `~~' | | _ . . `-----------. | `| .--. | | /_\ | _ _ _ |_ | _ _ _ ._ _ | | `\____|___\ | | |(_Y |/(_`/ `'_|| \|/_) / `/ \| | | | \_ | | | \_. |\._)\_.(_||_/|\_. O \_.\_/| | | | \_____| | `---------------------------------------"----------------'
On Sun, 18 Feb 2001 05:19:06 GMT, Nate / DAC <nos...@nospam.com> provoked the following text: >> You know, i only went as far as the Flash8, contrary to the SCPU it had very >> little compatibilty. I couldn't get GEOS to run stable, a lot of screens would >> be f*cked up, both in demos as well as in games. The only programs that really >> befitted from the Flash8 were Basic programs and a few other programs that just >> ran faster like a flightsim (don't remember the name) in which you could take >> off, climb to 40,000 feet and crash in 2 seconds flat :-)) > >Flight Simulator II has been patched for Super CPU, as has GEOS. However, >most games and demos still screw up, either because they use illegal >opcodes that only 6502 variants can execute (65816 doesn't have any >illegal ops), or they use 1 MHz-specific timing. > >Sometimes it's a memory mapping problem, but this, I would think, is >extremely rare since the Super CPU only adds a handful of registers to I/O >space. I think you misread my text, i wasn't talking about the SCPU but about the Flash8 accellerator cartridge. >> >> >Now if you have a CMD Hard Drive, which offers Parallel, >> >> You don't need a CMD drive to have a parallel drive. There were/are kits around >> >Certainly not, >> Certainly it could! I bought a kit and ran the 1541 in parallel mode >> for about a year before i retired the good old C64. >Sorry, my statement came out wrong - the "certainly not" was supposed to >enforce your "your dont need..." comment, not reject it. :) Ah, sorry 'bout that... >> >> I had that one! It came with a number of song, "99 Luftbalons" amongst >> >> others. >> >The one I'm thinking of only had one tune, something about "eliza" or so. >> In that case i think that we are thinking of two different programs. >> Mine was a program to make these tunes with. >Ahh, the one I tried didn't have a composer in it, it was just the one >tune. "Flowers for Eliza" or something like that? Still, a neat thing to >mess with, if you already had a nearly dead 1541 to play around with (I >wouldn't want to use that program on a known good drive :) A good drive would certainly survive it, it just vibrates the head in a similar way it does when reading a floppy, nothing more. >> >> Does it run standalone or does it need GEOS/Wheels? >> >It needs Wheels, a Super CPU with at least 1 MB of RAM, and a high speed >> >modem with Swiftlink-compatible RS232 card. >> What ever hapened to Net64? I'm on cable now and if i ever want to internet with >> the C64 i'll need that one. >64-Net? No, Net64 (i so sure that was the name), it enabled you to connect a C64 to a LAN. >> And when i checked again it was back up. If i ever need docs to the commie i >> know where to go :-) >Definitely. Be sure to obtain a copy of the C64 Programmer's Reference >Guide sometime, if you ever decide to mess with the C64 again (or with an >emulator, such as Vice).. It's an invaluable reference, tells you >everything you need to know short of describing the way the signals move >about through the machine :) Twalking about emulators: Years ago, the best C64 emu one could get was C64S, is that still the case or are there better emu's now? >> >True, a lot of the Commodore people get lazy when it comes to thier >> >websites (myself included). Some just don't take the time, though. >> I think it's time you go and do you part then! >Me? :) Yep! :-) >Actually my site's not too far out of date, only a few months at >worst. However, it probably could use a facelift. And where can i find your site? >> >Either way, there's a lot more to be done before these old machine can >> >rightfully be called 'dead'. So far, the end isn't in sight yet. >> I love it to see a true believer like i once was. >Curious...why did you give up using it anyways? Well, i bought a 286 for my wife and before long i had taken over the machine, trying stuff out (like "is it really impossible for a PC to read a C64 floppy?" 'n stuff). Then i discovered Windows 3.1 and i was impressed by the speed, the resolution and the high availability of software. Eventually i noticed that i didn't use my C64 anymore so after a few months collecting dust i decided to put it in my computer storage roon (yes, i have one) where it noe rests. Mind you, i didn't scrap it, nor did i retire it. It simply rests there. >> But i have never declared the commie dead, what i do say is that the >> scene isn't as vibrant as it once was. > >Agreed... Seems the most activty now is centered in Germany and >Poland. If you look at the US Scene just on the serface, it looks flat >out dead. But if you dig a little deeper, you'll turn up all kinds of >little goodies that we're doing now. One user, Jeri Ellsworth, is working >on a VGA card for C64 (I've seen the working prototype). Cool! In one of the CW's CMD had a suvey, asking if we would be interested in buying a C64 compatible computer if it required a VGA monitor. This reminds me a bit of that. >I'm working on an MP3 decoder board wrapped around the MAS3507-D chip >(www.micronas.com). > >Others are pursuing things like better CD-ROM support, multitasking OS's >like JOS, Ethernet support, etc. > >One friend of mine is working on a whole new C64 board - he wants to try >to pack the entire board, plus a few enhancements, into a single chip (in >VHDL I think). Very High Density Layers? Anyway, it sounds promising... -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 822wu/1.26yrs Learn Chinese in 5 minutes: Did you go to the beach?: Wai Yu So Tan?
Peter wrote : > Twalking about emulators: Years ago, the best C64 emu one could get was C64S, is > that still the case or are there better emu's now? Yes .. There is CC64S v 2.0 .. It gives near perfect emulation in every aspect. I use it and i'm very pleased with it. Also worth mentioning is VICE .. also very good. I also use Sidamp (the winamp plugin) for playing all my SID files. A good starting place is www.c64.com . And btw .. the www.fairlight.to site was updated recently. This discussion is way offtopic .. but I still find it interesting .. and so may other ascii-artists - Most of us are geek's anyways. OBascii : ,-. ( ) ,-. \ / ,-. ( :-X-: ) `-' / \ `-' ( ) `-' I'm not really sure .. I think its a prestage to something bigger .. diddles are very welcome. Or it could be a lucky clover :) 10 PRINT WARM REGARDS 20 PRINT CEEJAY
On Mon, 19 Feb 2001 06:32:47 +0100, "Christian 'CeeJay' Jensen" <new...@CeeJay.cjb.nOt> wrote: >10 PRINT WARM REGARDS >20 PRINT CEEJAY RUN ?SYNTAX ERROR IN 10 READY. .. ;-)
> >10 PRINT WARM REGARDS > >20 PRINT CEEJAY > RUN > > ?SYNTAX ERROR IN 10 > READY. > > .. ;-) Ok .. 10 ? "WARM REGARDS" 20 ? "CEEJAY" RUN
On Mon, 19 Feb 2001 06:32:47 +0100, "Christian 'CeeJay' Jensen" <new...@CeeJay.cjb.nOt> provoked the following text: >> Talking about emulators: Years ago, the best C64 emu one could get was >> C64S, is that still the case or are there better emu's now? >Yes .. There is CC64S v 2.0 .. It gives near perfect emulation in every >aspect. >I use it and i'm very pleased with it. > >Also worth mentioning is VICE .. also very good. > >I also use Sidamp (the winamp plugin) for playing all my SID files. I have downed it and i'm now playing the SidPlay themesong. It goes very well with the C64 skin i've downed from the fairlight page. >A good starting place is www.c64.com . I like it, bookmarked it! >And btw .. the www.fairlight.to site was updated recently. I have seen it and bookmarked it too. I also have downloaded WinVICE and i'm very curious as to what it looks like... >This discussion is way offtopic .. but I still find it interesting .. and so >may other ascii-artists - Most of us are geek's anyways. And besides, there are still only few people in the NGs that never had a C64 ("Well, i had one but i got tired from waiting for the tape to load...") >OBascii : > > ,-. > ( ) > ,-. \ / ,-. > ( :-X-: ) > `-' / \ `-' > ( ) > `-' > >I'm not really sure .. I think its a prestage to something bigger .. diddles >are very welcome. >Or it could be a lucky clover :) > >10 PRINT WARM REGARDS >20 PRINT CEEJAY 30 ?"AND PETER" 40 gO10 Dude, you really need to brush up on your CBM BASIC... :-) ObASCII to make nice: |||| |||| |||| |||| _.'.||,`,_ |_,' || `,_| Wait, WHAT AM I DOING???? -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 822wu/1.26yrs Sec. 8-3. Bell or other warning device. No person shall operate a bicycle unless it is equipped with a bell or device capable of giving a signal audible for a distance of at least 100 feet, but no bicycle shall be equipped with, nor shall any person use upon a bicycle, any siren or whistle. (Miami, Florida city law, Code 1967, � 8-3; Code 1980, � 8-3)
On Mon, 19 Feb 2001, Peter Punk wrote: > On Sun, 18 Feb 2001 05:19:06 GMT, Nate / DAC <nos...@nospam.com> provoked the > following text: > > >> You know, i only went as far as the Flash8, contrary to the SCPU it had very > > > >Flight Simulator II has been patched for Super CPU, as has GEOS. However, > >most games and demos still screw up, either because they use illegal > >opcodes that only 6502 variants can execute (65816 doesn't have any > >illegal ops), or they use 1 MHz-specific timing. > > > >Sometimes it's a memory mapping problem, but this, I would think, is > >extremely rare since the Super CPU only adds a handful of registers to I/O > >space. > > I think you misread my text, i wasn't talking about the SCPU but about the > Flash8 accellerator cartridge. Right, but I was just explaining that the Super CPU also sufferes from compatibility issues almost as much as the Flash-8, just letting you know that a SCPU probably wouldn't cure the compatibility issues you say with Flash 8 anyways, except for a handful of patched programs. > >mess with, if you already had a nearly dead 1541 to play around with (I > >wouldn't want to use that program on a known good drive :) > > A good drive would certainly survive it, it just vibrates the head in > a similar way it does when reading a floppy, nothing more. Well yeah, but I would think that vibrating the head at 1+ KHz would be more likely to burn out the stepper motor than, say, the usual of maybe 30 steps/second. > No, Net64 (i so sure that was the name), it enabled you to connect a C64 to a > LAN. Ahh. Never heard of this one. Only way I know to connect a C64 to a lan right now is RS232 to another host machine. > Talking about emulators: Years ago, the best C64 emu one could get > was C64S, is that still the case or are there better emu's now? C64S isn't all that great compared to the others - CCS64 and VICE the the two big ones right now. VIC is the only one that emulates PETs, the B and C 128's, VIC-20, and others. CCS64, if I remember right, is the most cycle-exact and fastest of the two. VICE's features, though, clearly outweigh CCS64's speed/cycle exactness. I know Ville Jouppi is on this newsgroup also, maybe he can answer this one. How about it, Jope? > And where can i find your site? <PLUG TAG="shameless"> http://home.kscable.com/natedac ...don't forget to check out my Tower page :) </PLUG> > >Curious...why did you give up using it anyways? > > Well, i bought a 286 for my wife and before long i had taken over the machine, > trying stuff out (like "is it really impossible for a PC to read a C64 floppy?" > 'n stuff). Then i discovered Windows 3.1 and i was impressed by the speed, the > resolution and the high availability of software. That can do it I guess (kinda ironic to hear someone mention the 286 and 'impressed by the speed' in the same paragraph ;) > Eventually i noticed that i didn't use my C64 anymore so after a few months > collecting dust i decided to put it in my computer storage roon (yes, i have > one) where it noe rests. What other machines do you have hiding in there? > Mind you, i didn't scrap it, nor did i retire it. It simply rests there. Glad to see you still kept it. I do encourage you to pull it outof the storage room and give it a run again, if only to see if it still works, etc :) > >little goodies that we're doing now. One user, Jeri Ellsworth, is working > >on a VGA card for C64 (I've seen the working prototype). > > Cool! In one of the CW's CMD had a suvey, asking if we would be interested in > buying a C64 compatible computer if it required a VGA monitor. This reminds me a > bit of that. Yeah, and you know CMD never did post the results of the survey, at least not that I remember. Their project, which they called "GUS", fell flat unfortuntely, before it even got off the drawing board. Jeri's video device sits on the cartridge slot now (used to be an internal daughterboard), and offers, what did she say, 256K of video ram I think? Anyways it was going to be run at something like 800x600 in 256 colors, using an indexed palette that could be swapped out on each scanline. The palette is 12-bits wide, giving 4096 colors. The method she proposed isn't all that dissimilar to FLI on the C64 or perhaps HAM on the Amiga. Her circuit doesn't include an actual video chip, instead it's generated by a CPLD and some RAM. When she gets to the functional part, I'm gonna see if I can talk her into putting a 65816 or 68K chip on it, as a graphics coprocessor (e.g. send commands like "DrawLine(X1,Y1,X2,Y2)"). > >One friend of mine is working on a whole new C64 board - he wants to try > >to pack the entire board, plus a few enhancements, into a single chip (in > >VHDL I think). > > Very High Density Layers? I can't remember what VHDL stands for, but I am certain the L stands for "language" or something.. -- ___________________________________ _____ _____ | _///@@@| | | nat...@kscable.com /'//ZZ@@|____ | | |'''/ |'/@7 | | http://home.kscable.com/natedac |`'| `~~' | | | `| .--. | | C64/C128 - What's *YOUR* hobby? | `\____|___\ | | \_ | | |___________________________________ \_____| _____|
On Mon, 19 Feb 2001, Nate / DAC wrote: > > Talking about emulators: Years ago, the best C64 emu one could get > > was C64S, is that still the case or are there better emu's now? > > C64S isn't all that great compared to the others - CCS64 and VICE the > the two big ones right now. VIC is the only one that emulates PETs, > the B and C 128's, VIC-20, and others. CCS64, if I remember right, is > the most cycle-exact and fastest of the two. I really need to work on my grammar/spelling. Ok Kids, how many errors can YOU spot in the above paragraph? -- ___________________________________ _____ _____ | _///@@@| | | nat...@kscable.com /'//ZZ@@|____ | | |'''/ |'/@7 | | http://home.kscable.com/natedac |`'| `~~' | | | `| .--. | | C64/C128 - What's *YOUR* hobby? | `\____|___\ | | \_ | | |___________________________________ \_____| _____|
On Mon, 19 Feb 2001 23:52:51 GMT, Nate / DAC <nos...@nospam.com> wrote: >> Talking about emulators: Years ago, the best C64 emu one could get >> was C64S, is that still the case or are there better emu's now? > >C64S isn't all that great compared to the others - CCS64 and VICE the the >two big ones right now. VIC is the only one that emulates PETs, the B and >C 128's, VIC-20, and others. CCS64, if I remember right, is the most >cycle-exact and fastest of the two. > >VICE's features, though, clearly outweigh CCS64's speed/cycle exactness. > >I know Ville Jouppi is on this newsgroup also, maybe he can answer this >one. > >How about it, Jope? Yes, I was almost going to comment on that one when Peter mentioned C64S.. C64S was very good back in '95, but nowadays it's been well surpassed by the newer emulators. At one point it seemed that everyone and their dog was coming out with a C64 emulator. Well, a few did rise out of the grey mass; VICE CCS64 Frodo Frodo was the first cycle exact emulator, but it's quite forgotten nowdays.. It was too far ahead of it's time.. When it came on the Amiga, there wasn't a machine fast enough to handle the heaviest version. Sorry, can't find an URL for this emulator. :-( CCS64 is WinTel only, does a good job and has been a good choice from the very beginning. It was the first to offer cartridge and REU support, for example. http://www.computerbrains.com/ccs64 VICE is portable, there are versions for quite a few platforms.. As Nate said, it's very feature rich, but not quite as exact as CCS. The C64 and PET emulators are good, but the VIC and C128 sides aren't 100% yet. Still waiting for the 264-series.. ;-) http://www.cs.cmu.edu/%7Edsladic/vice/vice.html I use Vice normally, and then switch to CCS if something doesn't look right with Vice. It's a matter of taste.. Before I started using VICE I swore by CCS.. :-) This is veering quite fast into comp.emulation.cbm.. :-) ObScii: oo ~( ") "" A mouse that looks disturbingly like a certain frog.. eek.
On Mon, 19 Feb 2001 13:44:41 +0100, "Christian 'CeeJay' Jensen" <new...@CeeJay.cjb.nOt> wrote: >> >10 PRINT WARM REGARDS >> >20 PRINT CEEJAY >> RUN >> >> ?SYNTAX ERROR IN 10 >> READY. >> >> .. ;-) > >Ok .. > >10 ? "WARM REGARDS" >20 ? "CEEJAY" >RUN WARM REGARDS CEEJAY READY.
ppu...@damthatspam.chello.nl (Peter Punk) writes: > On Sun, 18 Feb 2001 05:19:06 GMT, Nate / DAC <nos...@nospam.com> provoked the > following text: > > >One friend of mine is working on a whole new C64 board - he wants to try > >to pack the entire board, plus a few enhancements, into a single chip (in > >VHDL I think). Cool. An FPGA C64 clone. URL? <dreaming> Then an Amiga clone, then at 100s of MHz, with all mods. Who cares then any more what Commodores owner du jour does or doesn't? </dreaming> > Very High Density Layers? VHDL = VHSIC Hardware Description Language VHSIC = Very High Speed Integrated Circuit This is a programming language used to describe the interconnections of an chip circuit. Alternatives are Verilog, Abel, Palasm, Handel-C, Cnets, JBits, ... After editing one runs the file through an simulator (that was the original purpose of VHDL and Verilog, simulator input for logic design verification). Today one can then either use an silicon compiler and generate an chip layout (where the transistors go and how they are wired), or use an FPGA compiler and load the resulting file into an FPGA chip which is then programmed and which then becomes ones own personal chip. FPGA = Field Programmable Gate Array FPGAs are the "in" thing among avant garde emulator writers. Why write some slow software that burns through an PIII-800 to run an emulator at single C64 speed, when one can make an $5-50 chip into an 10-30 times faster C64 clone? And then directly plug in keyboard an monitor and have 38... Basic Bytes appear full screen, seconds after power up. And as FPGA code is code just like C code, there is already talk of open source hardware designs. P.S. I have just this January started an project to FPGA clone the 1970s PDP-10 mainframe: http://neil.franklin.ch/Projects/PDP-10/ > Anyway, it sounds promising... That it is. These are interesting times we live in. -- Neil Franklin, nei...@franklin.ch.remove http://neil.franklin.ch/ Hacker, Unix Guru, El Eng FH/BSc, Sysadmin, Roleplayer, LARPer, Mystic
On Tue, 20 Feb 2001 01:21:11 GMT, Nate / DAC <nos...@nospam.com> provoked the following text: >> > Talking about emulators: Years ago, the best C64 emu one could get >> > was C64S, is that still the case or are there better emu's now? >> >> C64S isn't all that great compared to the others - CCS64 and VICE the >> the two big ones right now. VIC is the only one that emulates PETs, >> the B and C 128's, VIC-20, and others. CCS64, if I remember right, is >> the most cycle-exact and fastest of the two. > >I really need to work on my grammar/spelling. Ok Kids, how many errors >can YOU spot in the above paragraph? - Missed an "are" in "CCS64 and VICE the the two big ones" - Missed an "is" in "remember right, is the most" That's all i can find Well, you asked... :-) -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 826wu/1.27yrs New York is real. The rest is done with mirrors.
On Mon, 19 Feb 2001 23:52:51 GMT, Nate / DAC <nos...@nospam.com> provoked the following text: >> >> You know, i only went as far as the Flash8, contrary to the SCPU it had very >> >Flight Simulator II has been patched for Super CPU, as has GEOS. However, >> >most games and demos still screw up, either because they use illegal >> >opcodes that only 6502 variants can execute (65816 doesn't have any >> >illegal ops), or they use 1 MHz-specific timing. >> >Sometimes it's a memory mapping problem, but this, I would think, is >> >extremely rare since the Super CPU only adds a handful of registers to I/O >> >space. >> I think you misread my text, i wasn't talking about the SCPU but about the >> Flash8 accellerator cartridge. >Right, but I was just explaining that the Super CPU also sufferes from >compatibility issues almost as much as the Flash-8, just letting you know >that a SCPU probably wouldn't cure the compatibility issues you say with >Flash 8 anyways, except for a handful of patched programs. OIC. BTW. The Flash8 came with a GEOS patch that didn't work. Now i have heared and read a lot about the SCPU and it seens that their patch does work. >> >mess with, if you already had a nearly dead 1541 to play around with (I >> >wouldn't want to use that program on a known good drive :) >> A good drive would certainly survive it, it just vibrates the head in >> a similar way it does when reading a floppy, nothing more. >Well yeah, but I would think that vibrating the head at 1+ KHz would be >more likely to burn out the stepper motor than, say, the usual of maybe >30 steps/second. Perhaps if you kept it playinjg all day, but about 15 minutes won't do any harm. After all, the stepper motor won't do anyting it can't do. >> No, Net64 (i so sure that was the name), it enabled you to connect a C64 to a >> LAN. >Ahh. Never heard of this one. Only way I know to connect a C64 to a lan >right now is RS232 to another host machine. Ethernet or a different type of LAN? >> Talking about emulators: Years ago, the best C64 emu one could get >> was C64S, is that still the case or are there better emu's now? >C64S isn't all that great compared to the others - CCS64 and VICE the the >two big ones right now. VIC is the only one that emulates PETs, the B and >C 128's, VIC-20, and others. CCS64, if I remember right, is the most >cycle-exact and fastest of the two. > >VICE's features, though, clearly outweigh CCS64's speed/cycle exactness. I have been playing around a bit with VICE now and i'm very impressed with it. However, the best test would be a GEOS image. Do you have any idea where i can find one? Best of all would be GEOS128 of course :-) >I know Ville Jouppi is on this newsgroup also, maybe he can answer this >one. > >How about it, Jope? > >> And where can i find your site? > ><PLUG TAG="shameless"> > >http://home.kscable.com/natedac Great site, however, the FTP search seems to be down. Any info on when it will be back up? >...don't forget to check out my Tower page :) Looks cool! Have you ever considered submitting it on www.virtualhideout.net ? >> >Curious...why did you give up using it anyways? >> >> Well, i bought a 286 for my wife and before long i had taken over the machine, >> trying stuff out (like "is it really impossible for a PC to read a C64 floppy?" >> 'n stuff). Then i discovered Windows 3.1 and i was impressed by the speed, the >> resolution and the high availability of software. > >That can do it I guess (kinda ironic to hear someone mention the 286 and >'impressed by the speed' in the same paragraph ;) <g> Well, it was an 15.4 MHz improvement over a stock C64 :-)) (i won't go into efficient programming, RISC and CISC processors, clock cycles per instruction etc... :-)) >> Eventually i noticed that i didn't use my C64 anymore so after a few months >> collecting dust i decided to put it in my computer storage roon (yes, i have >> one) where it noe rests. >What other machines do you have hiding in there? Hmm... Let me see... A dead VIC20 A dead C16 2 dead C128's (one plasic with 16K VDU and one metal with 64K VDU) 2 dead C64's 4 C64's with either minor problems or in working condition. A BBC 512 (512KB RAM, an 80186 daughterboard and a floppy drive) An Apple ][ An MSX (Mighty Strange eXperiment) An Epson laptop (CP/M 2.2, 40x5 LCD screen, mini tape drive) 10 Datasettes misc parts. Oh wait, i once built a C64 into a big('n heavy)tower. I still have it and it contains: 1 FD4000 (bought it just before they discontinued it) 1 1541 1 REU (128KB) 1 Flash8 it also featured: - Reset switch on the front. - Working HDD LED. - Audio out - Printer port - Keyboard connector for a C128 keyboard - 4 joystick connectors, 2 for each port. I kept my mouse always connected, if i wanted to use the joystick, i flipped the switch and the joystick was selected. On the other port i had a Sega gamepad (and it worked, it was from an 8-bit Sega) andthe other joystick. - An attempt to move the expantion port to the front failed, it wouldn't work. >> Mind you, i didn't scrap it, nor did i retire it. It simply rests there. >Glad to see you still kept it. I do encourage you to pull it outof the >storage room and give it a run again, if only to see if it still works, >etc :) Perhaps i will some day when i get more room :-) >> >little goodies that we're doing now. One user, Jeri Ellsworth, is working >> >on a VGA card for C64 (I've seen the working prototype). >> Cool! In one of the CW's CMD had a suvey, asking if we would be interested in >> buying a C64 compatible computer if it required a VGA monitor. This reminds me a >> bit of that. >Yeah, and you know CMD never did post the results of the survey, at least >not that I remember. Their project, which they called "GUS", fell flat >unfortuntely, before it even got off the drawing board. Pity, real pity. I think it would have made a geat C65 (of which only 2000 were built) replacement >Jeri's video device sits on the cartridge slot now (used to be an internal >daughterboard), and offers, what did she say, 256K of video ram I think? >Anyways it was going to be run at something like 800x600 in 256 colors, >using an indexed palette that could be swapped out on each scanline. Hmmm... so it's a hardware interlaced FLI generator? >The palette is 12-bits wide, giving 4096 colors. > >The method she proposed isn't all that dissimilar to FLI on the C64 or >perhaps HAM on the Amiga. LOL!!! I just said that, i really must learn to read ahead! :-)) >Her circuit doesn't include an actual video chip, instead it's generated >by a CPLD and some RAM. When she gets to the functional part, I'm gonna >see if I can talk her into putting a 65816 or 68K chip on it, as a >graphics coprocessor (e.g. send commands like "DrawLine(X1,Y1,X2,Y2)"). Well, by the way you describe it, it sounds like something we all should have! >> >One friend of mine is working on a whole new C64 board - he wants to try >> >to pack the entire board, plus a few enhancements, into a single chip (in >> >VHDL I think). >> Very High Density Layers? >I can't remember what VHDL stands for, but I am certain the L stands for >"language" or something.. Perhaps it's Very High Development Language? -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 826wu/1.27yrs Learn Chinese in 5 minutes: He's cleaning his automobile.: Wa Shing Ka
On Tue, 20 Feb 2001 10:20:51 +0200, Ville Jouppi <vjo...@sci.fi> provoked the following text: >>> Talking about emulators: Years ago, the best C64 emu one could get >>> was C64S, is that still the case or are there better emu's now? >> >>C64S isn't all that great compared to the others - CCS64 and VICE the the >>two big ones right now. VIC is the only one that emulates PETs, the B and >>C 128's, VIC-20, and others. CCS64, if I remember right, is the most >>cycle-exact and fastest of the two. >> >>VICE's features, though, clearly outweigh CCS64's speed/cycle exactness. I like VICE, it plays demos very well, better than C64S did. I also tried CCS64 but i git this flicker after loading an image... >>I know Ville Jouppi is on this newsgroup also, maybe he can answer this >>one. >> >>How about it, Jope? > >Yes, I was almost going to comment on that one when Peter mentioned C64S.. >C64S was very good back in '95, but nowadays it's been well surpassed by the >newer emulators. At one point it seemed that everyone and their dog was coming >out with a C64 emulator. Well, a few did rise out of the grey mass; > >VICE >CCS64 >Frodo > >Frodo was the first cycle exact emulator, but it's quite forgotten nowdays.. >It was too far ahead of it's time.. When it came on the Amiga, there wasn't a >machine fast enough to handle the heaviest version. >Sorry, can't find an URL for this emulator. :-( > >CCS64 is WinTel only, does a good job and has been a good choice from the very >beginning. It was the first to offer cartridge and REU support, for example. >http://www.computerbrains.com/ccs64 > >VICE is portable, there are versions for quite a few platforms.. As Nate said, >it's very feature rich, but not quite as exact as CCS. The C64 and PET >emulators are good, but the VIC and C128 sides aren't 100% yet. Still waiting >for the 264-series.. ;-) >http://www.cs.cmu.edu/%7Edsladic/vice/vice.html > >I use Vice normally, and then switch to CCS if something doesn't look right >with Vice. It's a matter of taste.. Before I started using VICE I swore by >CCS.. :-) > >This is veering quite fast into comp.emulation.cbm.. :-) LOL!!! I have been considering going there. Would i see you and Nate there? -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 827wu/1.27yrs The human animal differs from the lesser primates in his passion for lists of "Ten Best". -- H. Allen Smith
> OIC. BTW. The Flash8 came with a GEOS patch that didn't work. Now i > have heared and read a lot about the SCPU and it seens that their > patch does work. I think this patch was only for PAL machines, but I could be wrong there. As for GEOS, it works great, and Wheels works even better. Of course, if you're like me and want to multitask, CLiPS or JOS appears to be the way of the future :) > Perhaps if you kept it playinjg all day, but about 15 minutes won't do > any harm. After all, the stepper motor won't do anyting it can't do. True :) > >Ahh. Never heard of this one. Only way I know to connect a C64 to a lan > >right now is RS232 to another host machine. > > Ethernet or a different type of LAN? Just an RS232 connection, PPP over TCP/IP, to another host machine. Since the C64 then has access to all the facilities provided by the LAN, it's considered to be part of it. Each machine on a LAN is given a MAC address and some kind of IP address usually. So it's up to the host machine (which is your C64's gateway machine) to translate packets back and forth as needed. My PC has a function like this, called Network Address Translation, which allows my C128 to access the internet via PPP over TCP/IP, just like any other computer. I wouldn't need that feature if my C128 could connect directly to my cablemodem though. > I have been playing around a bit with VICE now and i'm very impressed with it. > However, the best test would be a GEOS image. Do you have any idea where i can > find one? Best of all would be GEOS128 of course :-) GEOS is kind of an ugly duckling when it comes to copying - it's probably the only legacy title left that you simply don't just freely copy. Instead you buy it from CMD. Now, once they're gone, then I guess copying it will be the only means to get it. The same thing, of course, also goes for new commercial programs being developed today; it's recommended that you just drop all that mid-80's mentality and just buck up and buy the program you need :) Most every other commercial program from that time period is fair game however; copy it all you like, no one will care usually. > ><PLUG TAG="shameless"> > > > >http://home.kscable.com/natedac > > Great site, however, the FTP search seems to be down. Any info on when it will > be back up? I'm not sure actually, I guess it's been down for a while now (some links on my site are probably out of date, I don't regularly use my pages anymore :) > >...don't forget to check out my Tower page :) > > Looks cool! Have you ever considered submitting it on > www.virtualhideout.net ? I've never heard of this site before, I'll check them out. > <g> Well, it was an 15.4 MHz improvement over a stock C64 :-)) Heh.. Of course at that time, C64 programmers really didn't know how to code compared to today, where a stock C64 today does what would have needed an accellerator 15 years ago, just because the coders have gotten a lot smarter/better :) > (i won't go into efficient programming, RISC and CISC processors, clock cycles No need, I did :) > A dead VIC20 > A dead C16 > 2 dead C128's (one plasic with 16K VDU and one metal with 64K VDU) > 2 dead C64's Which all need to be fixed, IMHO :) > 10 Datasettes Doorstops? (If any C64 accessory deserves the title, it's the datasette :) > misc parts. > > Oh wait, i once built a C64 into a big('n heavy)tower. [Snip specs] Not a bad setup there, I wish I had an FD4000, if only for bragging rights (wanna sell yours? :) > - An attempt to move the expantion port to the front failed, it wouldn't work. Four words: Unshielded Twisted-Pair Cable. > Pity, real pity. I think it would have made a geat C65 (of which only 2000 were > built) replacement Of course with all the hardware they have developed, one can assemble a pretty nice machine. Too bad it will set you back about $1300 (est.) to get all the goodies. > >Jeri's video device sits on the cartridge slot now (used to be an internal > >daughterboard), and offers, what did she say, 256K of video ram I think? > >Anyways it was going to be run at something like 800x600 in 256 colors, > >using an indexed palette that could be swapped out on each scanline. > > Hmmm... so it's a hardware interlaced FLI generator? ... > LOL!!! I just said that, i really must learn to read ahead! :-)) Not exactly like FLI, since that involves gobs of CPU overhead. Hers was pretty simple (from a functional standpoint), painting each raster line in 256 colors, picking them from the 512-byte table stored at the end of the raster line in video memory. > Well, by the way you describe it, it sounds like something we all should have! Oh it will be! She was able to show us a working prototype (it lacked any kind of command set or protocol) that displayed multicolor lines in a nice stable 31 kHz image. She had hoped to have her other version working, but had a hardware failure within just a day of the show. It offered functionality similar to the VIC-II chio found in eevry C64, but extended for high-resolution displays. I think her intent there was to actually emulate the VIC to some extent, so that her card could be a drop-in/plug-in replacement, at least for the VIC's display driver. -- ________________________________________________________ | . . | _____ | | _ _ _|_ _ _| _ _ | C64/C128- _///@@@| | | |/ \'_| | / \ / |'_| / ` | What's /'//ZZ@@|____ | | | |/ | | L-'| |/ || | *YOUR* |'''/ |'/@7 | | | |\_|_\_\_. \_|\_|_\_. | hobby? |`'| `~~' | | _ . . `-----------. | `| .--. | | /_\ | _ _ _ |_ | _ _ _ ._ _ | | `\____|___\ | | |(_Y |/(_`/ `'_|| \|/_) / `/ \| | | | \_ | | | \_. |\._)\_.(_||_/|\_. O \_.\_/| | | | \_____| | `---------------------------------------"----------------'
> LOL!!! I have been considering going there. Would i see you and Nate there?
After all this noise about emulation, would you believe that I don't
emulate on a regular basis? :)
I use the real thing when it's called for, and besides, what's Fort
Apocalypse anyways?
(duck, run)
--
___________________________________ _____ _____
| _///@@@| |
| nat...@kscable.com /'//ZZ@@|____ |
| |'''/ |'/@7 |
| http://home.kscable.com/natedac |`'| `~~' |
| | `| .--. |
| C64/C128 - What's *YOUR* hobby? | `\____|___\ |
| \_ | |
|___________________________________ \_____| _____|
On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 00:42:16 GMT, ppu...@damthatspam.chello.nl (Peter Punk) wrote: > >>This is veering quite fast into comp.emulation.cbm.. :-) > >LOL!!! I have been considering going there. Would i see you and Nate there? I'm afraid not.. We're residents of comp.sys.cbm .. where the Real Things are discussed.. :-)
On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 00:48:08 GMT, Nate / DAC <nos...@nospam.com> wrote: >> Perhaps if you kept it playinjg all day, but about 15 minutes won't do >> any harm. After all, the stepper motor won't do anyting it can't do. > >True :) I'll have to differ only a tiny bit - if the stepper's screws are even the tiniest bit loose, it'll throw off your head alignment.. Even if the screws ARE tight, it'll affect the alignment a bit. Not much, but a bit. And then a bit more and still some.. And in the end your head might be one or more tracks off alignment and this is not good if you want to share your files with someone else. :-) Then you'll have to painstakingly realign the head.. Whoopie. :-P
On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 09:17:58 +0200, Ville Jouppi <vjo...@sci.fi> provoked the following text: >>>This is veering quite fast into comp.emulation.cbm.. :-) >>LOL!!! I have been considering going there. Would i see you and Nate there? >I'm afraid not.. We're residents of comp.sys.cbm .. where the Real Things are >discussed.. :-) DANG!!! But wait, i'm sure that there are plenty of people in comp.emulation.cbm, yearning for your good advices! -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 827wu/1.27yrs The very ink with which all history is written is merely fluid prejudice.
On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 06:43:55 GMT, Nate Dannenberg <nat...@kscable.com> provoked the following text: >> LOL!!! I have been considering going there. Would i see you and Nate there? > >After all this noise about emulation, would you believe that I don't >emulate on a regular basis? :) After seeing your page (and hearing Modplay 128, great stuff!) i would! But will i see you there? >I use the real thing when it's called for, and besides, what's Fort >Apocalypse anyways? > >(duck, run) Fort Apocalypse is nothing compared to the games that game out on each issue of GO!64 and PlayTime. I found one the other day, it's called Fields of Hades. I hope to find more of them soon, i have a number of sites witrh loads of games and sids bookmarked, so there is a lot to choose from. I always liked those newer games best, usually made by demogroups. Oh, and i always liked demos. It's amazing what a good programmer can squeeze out of a 0.96 MHz computer with only 16 colours and 48K RAM (+16KB of kernal, copied to RAM) I liked tricks like FLI, cross-hatching (doesn't quite work on an emulator...) interrupt loaders with music, scrollers and all kinds of pretty effects. -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 827wu/1.27yrs The very ink with which all history is written is merely fluid prejudice.
On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 09:17:59 +0200, Ville Jouppi <vjo...@sci.fi> provoked the following text: >>> Perhaps if you kept it playinjg all day, but about 15 minutes won't do >>> any harm. After all, the stepper motor won't do anyting it can't do. >>True :) >I'll have to differ only a tiny bit - if the stepper's screws are even the >tiniest bit loose, it'll throw off your head alignment.. Even if the screws >ARE tight, it'll affect the alignment a bit. Not much, but a bit. And then a >bit more and still some.. And in the end your head might be one or more tracks >off alignment and this is not good if you want to share your files with >someone else. :-) > >Then you'll have to painstakingly realign the head.. Whoopie. :-P So never ever use GEOS, it keeps swapping to your floppy... -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 827wu/1.27yrs The very ink with which all history is written is merely fluid prejudice.
On 20 Feb 2001 21:02:52 +0100, Neil Franklin <nei...@franklin.ch.remove> provoked the following text: >> >One friend of mine is working on a whole new C64 board - he wants to try >> >to pack the entire board, plus a few enhancements, into a single chip (in >> >VHDL I think). > >Cool. An FPGA C64 clone. URL? > ><dreaming> >Then an Amiga clone, then at 100s of MHz, with all mods. Who cares >then any more what Commodores owner du jour does or doesn't? ></dreaming> Oh no! No Amiga clones! LOL!!! Next thing we know is she's gonna make a single-chip ZX Spectrum! >> Very High Density Layers? > >VHDL = VHSIC Hardware Description Language >VHSIC = Very High Speed Integrated Circuit 8< Snip wonderful explanation. >And as FPGA code is code just like C code, there is already talk of >open source hardware designs. Like the TransMeta CPU? >P.S. I have just this January started an project to FPGA clone the >1970s PDP-10 mainframe: http://neil.franklin.ch/Projects/PDP-10/ Looks impressive, but i don't understand any of it :-))) >> Anyway, it sounds promising... > >That it is. These are interesting times we live in. But the best times were the early 80's! -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 827wu/1.27yrs The very ink with which all history is written is merely fluid prejudice.
On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 00:48:08 GMT, Nate / DAC <nos...@nospam.com> provoked the following text: >> OIC. BTW. The Flash8 came with a GEOS patch that didn't work. Now i >> have heared and read a lot about the SCPU and it seens that their >> patch does work. >I think this patch was only for PAL machines, but I could be wrong there. >As for GEOS, it works great, and Wheels works even better. Of course, if >you're like me and want to multitask, CLiPS or JOS appears to be the way >of the future :) So where can i download a copy? :-) >> >Ahh. Never heard of this one. Only way I know to connect a C64 to a lan >> >right now is RS232 to another host machine. >> Ethernet or a different type of LAN? >Just an RS232 connection, PPP over TCP/IP, to another host machine. Something like direct cable connection in Win95/98? >Since the C64 then has access to all the facilities provided by the LAN, it's >considered to be part of it. > >Each machine on a LAN is given a MAC address and some kind of IP address >usually. So it's up to the host machine (which is your C64's gateway >machine) to translate packets back and forth as needed. My PC has a >function like this, called Network Address Translation, which allows my >C128 to access the internet via PPP over TCP/IP, just like any other >computer. > >I wouldn't need that feature if my C128 could connect directly to my >cablemodem though. Perhaps someone will build a LAN adapter for the CBM, it would then solve that problem. >> I have been playing around a bit with VICE now and i'm very impressed with it. >> However, the best test would be a GEOS image. Do you have any idea where i can >> find one? Best of all would be GEOS128 of course :-) > >GEOS is kind of an ugly duckling when it comes to copying - it's probably >the only legacy title left that you simply don't just freely copy. >Instead you buy it from CMD. As a D64 image? Oh, i have found a copy, but it won't work on VICE... >Now, once they're gone, then I guess copying >it will be the only means to get it. For me it is now. I have too low a budget to buy it. When i bought the FD4000, i had to pay 17.5% tax over it. That has discouraged me once and for all to order something from America. >The same thing, of course, also goes for new commercial programs being >developed today; it's recommended that you just drop all that mid-80's >mentality and just buck up and buy the program you need :) Too late, i am a child of the 80's and my mentality is not likely to change anymore. >Most every other commercial program from that time period is fair game >however; copy it all you like, no one will care usually. Ah, so where can i get GoDot with all plugins? >> ><PLUG TAG="shameless"> >> > >> >http://home.kscable.com/natedac >> >> Great site, however, the FTP search seems to be down. Any info on when it will >> be back up? > >I'm not sure actually, I guess it's been down for a while now (some links >on my site are probably out of date, I don't regularly use my pages >anymore :) You dopnj't have to use it, as long as you keep it up-to-date! :-) >> >...don't forget to check out my Tower page :) >> Looks cool! Have you ever considered submitting it on >> www.virtualhideout.net ? >I've never heard of this site before, I'll check them out. What did you think of it? I love their Cool Case Gallery! There is also a modded C64... >> <g> Well, it was an 15.4 MHz improvement over a stock C64 :-)) >Heh.. Of course at that time, C64 programmers really didn't know how to >code compared to today, where a stock C64 today does what would have >needed an accellerator 15 years ago, just because the coders have gotten a >lot smarter/better :) I thought they were very good around 1996/1997 >> A dead VIC20 >> A dead C16 >> 2 dead C128's (one plasic with 16K VDU and one metal with 64K VDU) >> 2 dead C64's > >Which all need to be fixed, IMHO :) When i declare a computer dead, it is beyond repair. - The C16 was blown up by someone (not me!) who thought that a regular adapter could replace a CBM adapter. Result: mobo fried. _ The VIC20 had no mobo anymore when i found it. - One C128 has a defective VDU, all my efforts to find a replacement failed miserably. - The other C128 had a defective 1571 so i replaced it with the drive from the one with the defectiver VDU. I accidently connected the drive's powerplug upside-down and the result was a fried mobo (i still don't know how that could be, but it's dead.) - The 2 dead C64's were cannibalized for parts. >> 10 Datasettes >Doorstops? (If any C64 accessory deserves the title, it's the datasette :) Well, i have been able to make a few people happy with a new, out-of-the-box datasette (complete with manual). >> misc parts. >> Oh wait, i once built a C64 into a big('n heavy)tower. >[Snip specs] >Not a bad setup there, I wish I had an FD4000, if only for bragging rights >(wanna sell yours? :) Nope, if i'm never gonna use it again, i'll still keep it for sentimental reasons. But i'm sure i will use it again one day. >> - An attempt to move the expantion port to the front failed, it wouldn't work. >Four words: Unshielded Twisted-Pair Cable. That was the solution??? I used an old IDE flatcable. >> Pity, real pity. I think it would have made a great C65 (of which only 2000 were >> built) replacement >Of course with all the hardware they have developed, one can assemble a >pretty nice machine. Too bad it will set you back about $1300 (est.) to >get all the goodies. So how much would a state-of-the-art PC cost? Or an Apple? One day i will have more money than i have now, and then i will buy me a setup you freaks wil all be jealous of! :-)) >> >Jeri's video device sits on the cartridge slot now (used to be an internal >> >daughterboard), and offers, what did she say, 256K of video ram I think? >> >Anyways it was going to be run at something like 800x600 in 256 colors, >> >using an indexed palette that could be swapped out on each scanline. >> >> Hmmm... so it's a hardware interlaced FLI generator? > >Not exactly like FLI, since that involves gobs of CPU overhead. Who cares? As long as that CPU is on the card... :-) >Hers was >pretty simple (from a functional standpoint), painting each raster line in >256 colors, picking them from the 512-byte table stored at the end of the >raster line in video memory. Effectively cross-hatching. But from hardware. Very inventive! >> Well, by the way you describe it, it sounds like something we all should have! > >Oh it will be! She was able to show us a working prototype (it lacked any >kind of command set or protocol) that displayed multicolor lines in a nice >stable 31 kHz image. She had hoped to have her other version working, but >had a hardware failure within just a day of the show. Damn that Murphy guy! >It offered >functionality similar to the VIC-II chio found in eevry C64, but extended >for high-resolution displays. I think her intent there was to actually >emulate the VIC to some extent, so that her card could be a >drop-in/plug-in replacement, at least for the VIC's display driver. You know, i once wrote CMD, asking if it would be possible to build a VIC replacement that offered at least 256 colours. They wrote me back and said that it would be possible, but that it was very unlikely that they would undertake such a project since they were already involved in other projects. Soon after that, the first working prototype of the SCPU was shown to the public. -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 827wu/1.27yrs The very ink with which all history is written is merely fluid prejudice.
> >And btw .. the www.fairlight.to site was updated recently. > > I have seen it and bookmarked it too. I also have downloaded WinVICE and i'm > very curious as to what it looks like... CC64S is my favourite .. note it's CC64S not C64S .. It's not the same emulator though based on the original i think. I prefer the colors from CC64S v 1 to thoose from CC64S v 2 but it's easily copied and setup in v 2. > >This discussion is way offtopic .. but I still find it interesting .. and so > >may other ascii-artists - Most of us are geek's anyways. > > And besides, there are still only few people in the NGs that never had a C64 > ("Well, i had one but i got tired from waiting for the tape to load...") I never owned a tape .. My first computer was the 128D (builtin 1541) > >OBascii : > > > > ,-. > > ( ) > > ,-. \ / ,-. > > ( :-X-: ) > > `-' / \ `-' > > ( ) > > `-' > > > >I'm not really sure .. I think its a prestage to something bigger .. diddles > >are very welcome. > >Or it could be a lucky clover :) > > > >10 PRINT WARM REGARDS > >20 PRINT CEEJAY > > 30 ?"AND PETER" > 40 gO10 > > Dude, you really need to brush up on your CBM BASIC... :-) I corrected it .. see the other post. And hey .. they don't even make the machine anymore ! > ObASCII to make nice: > > |||| > |||| > |||| > |||| > _.'.||,`,_ > |_,' || `,_| > > Wait, WHAT AM I DOING???? Death to the heretic !!! *g*
On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 22:12:16 GMT, ppu...@damthatspam.chello.nl (Peter Punk) wrote: >On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 09:17:58 +0200, Ville Jouppi <vjo...@sci.fi> provoked the >following text: > >>>>This is veering quite fast into comp.emulation.cbm.. :-) >>>LOL!!! I have been considering going there. Would i see you and Nate there? >>I'm afraid not.. We're residents of comp.sys.cbm .. where the Real Things are >>discussed.. :-) > >DANG!!! But wait, i'm sure that there are plenty of people in >comp.emulation.cbm, yearning for your good advices! Heh.. Quite a few of the cscbm-residents hang out in emulators too.. I just have too many groups as it is and I'm really not interested in seeing lots of ppl asking for C-64 r0mZzZZ?!1!? over and over again.. (well hopefully that has quietened down a bit)
On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 22:42:12 GMT, ppu...@damthatspam.chello.nl (Peter Punk) wrote: >On Wed, 21 Feb 2001 09:17:59 +0200, Ville Jouppi <vjo...@sci.fi> provoked the >following text: > >>Then you'll have to painstakingly realign the head.. Whoopie. :-P > >So never ever use GEOS, it keeps swapping to your floppy... Yes, but in that sense, never use the drive at all. Those drive music programs vibrate the stepper as fast as it can go, which is a lot more stress than normal use. On a modern floppy mech, if you move the heads faster than the stepper's specs allow, the drive will break.. The 1541 mechanisms are generally a bit more robust.
On Thu, 22 Feb 2001 02:45:16 +0100, "Christian 'CeeJay' Jensen" <new...@CeeJay.cjb.nOt> wrote: >> I have seen it and bookmarked it too. I also have downloaded WinVICE and i'm >> very curious as to what it looks like... > >CC64S is my favourite .. note it's CC64S not C64S .. It's not the same >emulator though based on the original i think. > >I prefer the colors from CC64S v 1 to thoose from CC64S v 2 but it's easily >copied and setup in v 2. That sounds awfully like CCS 64.. Colours in setup, v1 and v2.. >> >This discussion is way offtopic .. but I still find it interesting .. and >so >> >may other ascii-artists - Most of us are geek's anyways. >> >> And besides, there are still only few people in the NGs that never had a C64 >> ("Well, i had one but i got tired from waiting for the tape to load...") > >I never owned a tape .. My first computer was the 128D (builtin 1541) 1571, actually.. :-) Double sided, burst transfers, MFM support (for reading all those CP/M formats). Always keep your 1571's heads down (door closed) when in storage! If you don't you'll end up with an unusable drive when the top head's mounting breaks.
I wrote: > >After all this noise about emulation, would you believe that I don't > >emulate on a regular basis? :) And Peter Replied: > After seeing your page (and hearing Modplay 128, great stuff!) i would! > > But will i see you there? Nope, haven't visited it for ages :) > >I use the real thing when it's called for, and besides, what's Fort > >Apocalypse anyways? > > Fort Apocalypse is nothing... Heh, the Fort Apocalypse thing was a joke running in c.e.c, though I'm not entirely sure how it originated. > ...compared to the games that game out on each issue of GO!64 and > PlayTime. Go64! is a good resource for C64 users, no doubt of that :) > Oh, and i always liked demos. It's amazing what a good programmer can > squeeze out of a 0.96 MHz computer with only 16 colours and 48K RAM > (+16KB of kernal, copied to RAM) PAL is ~0.985 MHz, NTSC is 1.022727 MHz. :-) The machine has ~64K of regular 8-bit RAM, 1K of 4-bit wide RAM for the VIC color map, 20K of ROMs, and 3K of I/O devices (much of which is not actually allocated, but contains mirrors of real, allocated blocks). The ROM code is not copied to RAM at all, in any configuration, except for one exception (see below). You can if you want, but then you're giving up valuable RAM for your program code, and the RAM isn't any faster than ROM. From the 6510 CPU's viewpoint [1]: 0000/0001: Processor's RAM/ROM/I/O banking register, and datasette. 0002-00FF: Zero Page RAM 0100-01FF: Processor stack 0200-03FF: RAM: BASIC/Kernal variables and such 0400-07FF: RAM: Default location for Text screen 0800-7FFF: RAM: BASIC program space 8000-9FFF: RAM: BASIC program space, or external function ROM A000-BFFF: BASIC ROM, or RAM if switched out, or external function ROM C000-CFFF: RAM: Unused by the OS, good place for small ML programs. D000-DFFF: I/O Devices [2] D800-DBFF: Color RAM, 4-bits wide [2] DC00-DFFF: More I/O devices [2] D000-DFFF: Character ROM, or RAM [3] E000-FFF9: Kernal ROM, or RAM if switched out, or external function ROM FFFA-FFFF: Interrupt vectors [4] [1] In all cases, if a ROM (whatever it's origin) is visible to the processor, any write to that ROM area will actually be directed to the RAM hidden under the ROM, and reads will return data from the ROM, of course. The VIC video chip can't see the BASIC and Kernal ROMs at all, in any mode. The Character ROM is always visible to it regardless of the setting of $0000/1, and there are echoes at $1000 and $9000 that only VIC can see. [2] In the case of the D000-DFFF area, the two blocks of I/O devices and the color RAM are treated as a single unit when it comes to switching them out. [3] If I/O devices are switched out, the Character ROM is visible in this area instead. You can further switch that ROM out to reveal 4K of RAM underneath. [4] Interrupt vectors are normally taken from the Kernal ROM when it's switched in. Otherwise, they are taken from RAM. These are the NMI, Reset, and IRQ vectors, two bytes each. When the entire ~64K is made visible (all ROMs and I/O switched out), a total of 518 bytes of the now CPU-visible space are considered special- purpose memory for various things: The two bytes of the processor's banking register and datasette interface are actually an on-chip I/O port, part of which connects to the memory map decoder chip (the PLA), to handle RAM/ROM/I/O banking. The 254 bytes of ZeroPage normally contain vectors, pointers, temporary storage, and other such stuff, but you can also put code here. In fact, on start up, the BASIC interpreter places a few bytes of the ROM's "CHRGET" routine here for speed. The 256 bytes of the Processor Stack. Code can go here, but it's not a smart idea unless you're really hurting for program space. The 6 bytes of Interrupt Vectors, as above. Also, at least 1K of RAM must be allocated somewhere in the memory map for the screen, the default being at $0400. Code is often placed right in this RAM (and blacked out by filling Color RAM with 0's), often as a temporary place to run it from, like in a depacker/decruncher routine. No need for the routine once the program starts, so why not overwrite it with display data? :) -- ___________________________________ _____ _____ | _///@@@| | | nat...@kscable.com /'//ZZ@@|____ | | |'''/ |'/@7 | | http://home.kscable.com/natedac |`'| `~~' | | | `| .--. | | C64/C128 - What's *YOUR* hobby? | `\____|___\ | | \_ | | |___________________________________ \_____| _____|
> >CC64S is my favourite .. note it's CC64S not C64S .. It's not the same > >emulator though based on the original i think. > > > >I prefer the colors from CC64S v 1 to thoose from CC64S v 2 but it's easily > >copied and setup in v 2. > > That sounds awfully like CCS 64.. Colours in setup, v1 and v2.. You are right - I just mixed up the letters. CCS64 it is. > >> >This discussion is way offtopic .. but I still find it interesting .. and > >so > >> >may other ascii-artists - Most of us are geek's anyways. > >> > >> And besides, there are still only few people in the NGs that never had a C64 > >> ("Well, i had one but i got tired from waiting for the tape to load...") > > > >I never owned a tape .. My first computer was the 128D (builtin 1541) > > 1571, actually.. :-) Double sided, burst transfers, MFM support (for reading > all those CP/M formats). Again you are right .. I thought about this after i had sent the post but didn't bother as the main message was clear .. the one with the builtin floppydrive. > Always keep your 1571's heads down (door closed) when in storage! If you don't > you'll end up with an unusable drive when the top head's mounting breaks. That why it came with a protective piece of cardboard to insert when transporting it. I always used either that or a floppy i didn't care if I ruined. Anyways it does matter now .. I sold it some years ago (but still had it for many years aaftyer they stopped making it). Got an extremly good price too. Money i used on buying an accelerator for my Amiga (which I still have .. and think about selling since my amiga needs can now be filled by an emulator and if i'm going to use one again it will have to be new hardware .. and new amiga's are very much speculative dreaming.)
ppu...@damthatspam.chello.nl (Peter Punk) writes: > On 20 Feb 2001 21:02:52 +0100, Neil Franklin <nei...@franklin.ch.remove> provoked > the following text: > > >Cool. An FPGA C64 clone. URL? > > > ><dreaming> > ></dreaming> > > Oh no! No Amiga clones! LOL!!! > Next thing we know is she's gonna make a single-chip ZX Spectrum! Sounds also interesting. > >And as FPGA code is code just like C code, there is already talk of > >open source hardware designs. > > Like the TransMeta CPU? Not at all. Transmeta is essentially the return [1] of microcode. That is an very primitive processor that is specialised in running emulators. Software for such an chip is an emulator program, for example an x86 emulator. Designing is writing such an program. [1] Most [2] of the IBM 360 (and 370) mainframes used that technique. IBM actually sold various price/performance emulators running their particular 360 emulations! [2] all 360s exept the 360/44 and 360/91. These two were actual hardware 360 (only subsets) that used trapping techniques to emulate the rest of the instructions. Same trick as an 386 or 486SX trapping the 387 or 487SX instructions when no FPU chip was in the PC. OTOH an FPGA is an regular array of programmable universal logic elements surrounded by many short bits of "wire" that can be connected together with switch transistors. Software is an bit array the activates the proper switches and logic configurations. Designing is really selecting logic element configurations and then witing them, i.e. real electrical engineering. > >P.S. I have just this January started an project to FPGA clone the > >1970s PDP-10 mainframe: http://neil.franklin.ch/Projects/PDP-10/ > > Looks impressive, but i don't understand any of it :-))) I expect it to be unreadable unless one has either PDP-10 or FPGA knowlege. And I suspect one needs both :-). > >That it is. These are interesting times we live in. > > But the best times were the early 80's! For PDP-10s that was already the time of dying. 1970s were the strong days. I am aiming for the KI-10 model that dominated 1969-1975. -- Neil Franklin, nei...@franklin.ch.remove http://neil.franklin.ch/ Hacker, Unix Guru, El Eng FH/BSc, Sysadmin, Roleplayer, LARPer, Mystic
On Thu, 22 Feb 2001 02:45:16 +0100, "Christian 'CeeJay' Jensen" <new...@CeeJay.cjb.nOt> provoked the following text: >> >And btw .. the www.fairlight.to site was updated recently. >> I have seen it and bookmarked it too. I also have downloaded WinVICE and i'm >> very curious as to what it looks like... >CC64S is my favourite .. note it's CC64S not C64S .. It's not the same >emulator though based on the original i think. Well, since i'm on a roll... I'll try it, but which of the 4 versions should i get? >> >This discussion is way offtopic .. but I still find it interesting .. and >> >so may other ascii-artists - Most of us are geek's anyways. >> And besides, there are still only few people in the NGs that never had a C64 >> ("Well, i had one but i got tired from waiting for the tape to load...") >I never owned a tape .. My first computer was the 128D (builtin 1541) Ermmm... I noticed a tiny mistake (well, actually it's a big one since you're a C128 owner...) The C128D did not have a 1541 built in but a 1571. The difference is that the 1571 has 2 heads and can use both sides of the disk without having to flip the disk, provided it has been properly formatted. I'm still wondering what improvement the 1570 offered. It was the 1571's predecessor but had only one R/W head. Perhaps it had burstmode like the 1571, that could be it. >> >10 PRINT WARM REGARDS >> >20 PRINT CEEJAY >> >> 30 ?"AND PETER" >> 40 gO10 >> >> Dude, you really need to brush up on your CBM BASIC... :-) > >I corrected it .. see the other post. >And hey .. they don't even make the machine anymore ! But there are plenty of emulators around to practice in! :-) >> ObASCII to make nice: >> >> |||| >> |||| >> |||| >> |||| >> _.'.||,`,_ >> |_,' || `,_| >> >> Wait, WHAT AM I DOING???? > >Death to the heretic !!! *g* Did you rather have a ZX-Spectrum logo? -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 827wu/1.27yrs The very ink with which all history is written is merely fluid prejudice.
On Thu, 22 Feb 2001 15:34:30 +0100, "Christian 'CeeJay' Jensen" <new...@CeeJay.cjb.nOt> provoked the following text: >> >> >This discussion is way offtopic .. but I still find it interesting .. >> >> >and so may other ascii-artists - Most of us are geek's anyways. >> >> And besides, there are still only few people in the NGs that never had a >> >> C64 ("Well, i had one but i got tired from waiting for the tape to load...") >> >I never owned a tape .. My first computer was the 128D (builtin 1541) >> 1571, actually.. :-) Double sided, burst transfers, MFM support (for reading >> all those CP/M formats). >Again you are right .. I thought about this after i had sent the post but >didn't bother as the main message was clear .. the one with the builtin >floppydrive. Ah, but there was not just one C128 with built-in FDD but two. The first one, the C128D had a plastic housing, a handle to carry it from one place to another (like you would! it was too heavy!) and a 16KB VDU. The second one, the C128DCR had a metal housing, was a bit lower in height than the C128D and had a 64KB VDU. >Anyways it does matter now .. I sold it some years ago (but still had it for >many years aaftyer they stopped making it). Ah, but VICE also comes with a C128DCR emulation! >Got an extremly good price too. >Money i used on buying an accelerator for my Amiga (which I still have .. and >think about selling since my amiga needs can now be filled by an emulator and >if i'm going to use one again it will have to be new hardware .. and new >amiga's are very much speculative dreaming.) Amiga? YUCK! 8-bits are the way of the future! -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 827wu/1.27yrs The very ink with which all history is written is merely fluid prejudice.
On Fri, 23 Feb 2001 00:36:30 GMT, ppu...@damthatspam.chello.nl (Peter Punk)
wrote:
>Amiga? YUCK! 8-bits are the way of the future!
I resent that remark .. :-) Amigas are still in part my way of life.. :-)
On Fri, 23 Feb 2001 00:30:35 GMT, ppu...@damthatspam.chello.nl (Peter Punk) wrote: >I'm still wondering what improvement the 1570 offered. It was the 1571's >predecessor but had only one R/W head. >Perhaps it had burstmode like the 1571, that could be it. The 1570 was an in-between model released quicky because C= couldn't rpduce 1571s fast enough. It has burst mode and MFM support, but only one head because of the 1541 mechanism it uses. The first cases were brown cases that were painted white and the decal was just a piece of cardboard stuck on in comparison to the metal decal of the 1541. The 1570 actually has a modified 1571 PCB inside. My are these threads getting interesting to the fellow ascii-arters.. :-) ObAscii: ___ | | | | O | |___| 5.25" floppy
On Fri, 23 Feb 2001 22:33:40 +0200, Ville Jouppi <vjo...@sci.fi> provoked the following text: >>Amiga? YUCK! 8-bits are the way of the future! >I resent that remark .. :-) Amigas are still in part my way of life.. :-) (it feels like old times! :-))))) -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 841wu/1.29yrs USER, n.: The word computer professionals use when they mean "idiot." -- Dave Barry, "Claw Your Way to the Top"
On 22 Feb 2001 20:21:20 +0100, Neil Franklin <nei...@franklin.ch.remove> provoked the following text: >> >Cool. An FPGA C64 clone. URL? >> ><dreaming> >> ></dreaming> >> Oh no! No Amiga clones! LOL!!! >> Next thing we know is she's gonna make a single-chip ZX Spectrum! >Sounds also interesting. AAAAAARRGGGHHH!!! You heretic! :-) >> >And as FPGA code is code just like C code, there is already talk of >> >open source hardware designs. >> Like the TransMeta CPU? >Not at all. Last thing i heard is that the Transmeta is open source... >> >P.S. I have just this January started an project to FPGA clone the >> >1970s PDP-10 mainframe: http://neil.franklin.ch/Projects/PDP-10/ >> Looks impressive, but i don't understand any of it :-))) >I expect it to be unreadable unless one has either PDP-10 or FPGA >knowlege. And I suspect one needs both :-). And i have neither! :-) >> >That it is. These are interesting times we live in. >> But the best times were the early 80's! >For PDP-10s that was already the time of dying. 1970s were the strong >days. I am aiming for the KI-10 model that dominated 1969-1975. Bad music, bad hair, bad times over all. And worst of all: no C64! -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 841wu/1.29yrs "There are three possibilities: Pioneer's solar panel has turned away from the sun; there's a large meteor blocking transmission; or someone loaded Star Trek 3.2 into our video processor."
On Fri, 23 Feb 2001 22:33:40 +0200, Ville Jouppi <vjo...@sci.fi> provoked the following text: >>Amiga? YUCK! 8-bits are the way of the future! >I resent that remark .. :-) Amigas are still in part my way of life.. :-) So what can your Amiga do that a C64 can't? -- Peter Punk \ / ---\\\\--- / \ Draai je V3.03 al van de SETI@home client? http://home.hetnet.nl/~setiathomegroep/index.html voor tips, antwoorden, discussies. links, downloads en meer. 841wu/1.29yrs No male is allowed to be in a state of arousal in public. (Kenosha, Wisconsin city law)
On Sat, 24 Feb 2001 02:26:03 GMT, ppu...@damthatspam.chello.nl (Peter Punk) wrote: >On Fri, 23 Feb 2001 22:33:40 +0200, Ville Jouppi <vjo...@sci.fi> provoked the >following text: > >>>Amiga? YUCK! 8-bits are the way of the future! >>I resent that remark .. :-) Amigas are still in part my way of life.. :-) > >So what can your Amiga do that a C64 can't? Well for starters; Burn CDs, play mp3s without extra hardware, show MPG, AVI, QT files, multitask with a graphical GUI? There's quite a bit of stuff the C-64 can't do and probably never will. The mp3 part is being worked on by Nate, but the decoding is done externally. I hear JOS will multitask with a gui eventually, and CD burning just might be feasible using the CMD SCSI controller. But it's not there yet and I'm willing to say the Amiga is much nicer to use than the C-64 for those applications. Doing all that stuff on a C-64 is more of a hack value - you can buy a decent used PC for the same price you pay to get your C-64 up to date.. It's very much so with the Amiga too. You can buy a several times more powerful NEW PC for the price of a loaded Amiga with all the parts bought new. C'est la vie. I hate the fact that I have to pay at least 600FIM for a network card when PC owners can buy a faster one for around 100FIM. Let's not get into display adapters or HD controllers.. :-/
> >So what can your Amiga do that a C64 can't? > > Well for starters; Burn CDs, play mp3s without extra hardware, show MPG, AVI, > QT files, multitask with a graphical GUI? There's quite a bit of stuff the > C-64 can't do and probably never will. > > The mp3 part is being worked on by Nate, but the decoding is done externally. Yes, via a Micronas Intermetall MAS 3507-D chip and a CS4338 DAC. It's based on the Amiga MASPlayer design by Dirk Conrad. > I hear JOS will multitask with a gui eventually It already does, and quite well I might add :) > and CD burning just might be feasible using the CMD SCSI controller. Actually I read someplace about a CD burner designed just for slower machines, made by Panasonic I think. Its designed not to trash discs when the buffer underflows, instead it just turns the laser off. I think this was posted either on the COPS or Homestead lists (see www.videocam.net.au in the C64 section for more details). SUpposedly one of these would work on a CMD HD without the worry of too slow of access to the data. Also I read that someone has already started working on a CD burner program, possibly for CD-RW discs (since those work more or less like a really big floppy disc). -- ___________________________________ _____ _____ | _///@@@| | | nat...@kscable.com /'//ZZ@@|____ | | |'''/ |'/@7 | | http://home.kscable.com/natedac |`'| `~~' | | | `| .--. | | C64/C128 - What's *YOUR* hobby? | `\____|___\ | | \_ | | |___________________________________ \_____| _____|
Hi, Ville Jouppi <vjo...@sci.fi> wrote about: > >>I resent that remark .. :-) Amigas are still in part my way of life.. :-) > >So what can your Amiga do that a C64 can't? > Well for starters; Burn CDs, play mp3s without extra hardware, show MPG, AVI, > QT files, multitask with a graphical GUI? There's quite a bit of stuff the > C-64 can't do and probably never will. hmm, that's what I like Amiga for. > I hate the fact that I have to pay at least 600FIM for a network card when PC > owners can buy a faster one for around 100FIM. Let's not get into display > adapters or HD controllers.. :-/ well, but why do we discuss here, I thought this group is 'bout ascii-art - so let's like our Amiga and stop this thread cu, -- flori Amiga1200, PPC/060, Graka ...
On Sat, 24 Feb 2001 22:48:06 GMT, Nate Dannenberg <nat...@kscable.com> wrote: >> I hear JOS will multitask with a gui eventually > >It already does, and quite well I might add :) Ok.. I haven't had the opportunity to try it. :-( >> and CD burning just might be feasible using the CMD SCSI controller. > >Actually I read someplace about a CD burner designed just for slower >machines, made by Panasonic I think. Its designed not to trash discs when >the buffer underflows, instead it just turns the laser off. I think this >was posted either on the COPS or Homestead lists (see www.videocam.net.au >in the C64 section for more details). Plextor and Sanyo have those BurnProof-drives too. >SUpposedly one of these would work on a CMD HD without the worry of too >slow of access to the data. Also I read that someone has already started >working on a CD burner program, possibly for CD-RW discs (since those work >more or less like a really big floppy disc). Why not. as I said it just might be feasible.. Maybe connect a reader to the bus and copy discs.. That would be a cool novelty item for the trendy retrocomputing-person. I've succesfully burned CDs at 2x on an A500 with only 4MB fast and an A590 controller.. Worked fine. The A590 manages 1,5MB/sec on a stock machine.. Quite impressive IMO.
ROFLOL 5 x="warm Regards" 7 locate 20, 40 10 PRINT x 20 PRINT "CEEJAY" 30 GOTO 10 40 END something like that anyway....LOL "Christian 'CeeJay' Jensen" <new...@CeeJay.cjb.nOt> wrote in message news:96r4da$lfn$1...@news.inet.tele.dk... > >10 PRINT WARM REGARDS > >20 PRINT CEEJAY > RUN > > ?SYNTAX ERROR IN 10 > READY. > > .. ;-) Ok .. 10 ? "WARM REGARDS" 20 ? "CEEJAY" RUN
1977... TRS-80 Model 1 5 REMARK :TRS-80 Radio Shack BASIC Level 2: 10 FOR X=1 to 25 20 IF X/5<>ABS(X/5) THEN PRINT "Hello there" ELSE PRINT "Hello there, you dummy!!! 30 NEXT X 40 BEEP 50 GOTO 10 On Sun, 11 Mar 2001 12:16:15 -0500, "KIESEYHOW \(K-man\)" <kie...@hawk.igs.net> wrote: >ROFLOL > >5 x="warm Regards" >7 locate 20, 40 >10 PRINT x >20 PRINT "CEEJAY" >30 GOTO 10 >40 END > > >something like that anyway....LOL > > >"Christian 'CeeJay' Jensen" <new...@CeeJay.cjb.nOt> wrote in message >news:96r4da$lfn$1...@news.inet.tele.dk... >> >10 PRINT WARM REGARDS >> >20 PRINT CEEJAY >> RUN >> >> ?SYNTAX ERROR IN 10 >> READY. >> >> .. ;-) > >Ok .. > >10 ? "WARM REGARDS" >20 ? "CEEJAY" >RUN > > > > > Remove ".SPAMNOT" from addy to e-mail me
mmmh. C64 doesn't have a locate instruction (and uses x$ variables for strings) "KIESEYHOW (K-man)" wrote: > > ROFLOL > > 5 x="warm Regards" > 7 locate 20, 40 > 10 PRINT x > 20 PRINT "CEEJAY" > 30 GOTO 10 > 40 END > > something like that anyway....LOL > > "Christian 'CeeJay' Jensen" <new...@CeeJay.cjb.nOt> wrote in message > news:96r4da$lfn$1...@news.inet.tele.dk... > > >10 PRINT WARM REGARDS > > >20 PRINT CEEJAY > > RUN > > > > ?SYNTAX ERROR IN 10 > > READY. > > > > .. ;-) > > Ok .. > > 10 ? "WARM REGARDS" > 20 ? "CEEJAY" > RUN
Throw in a lurker's two cents:
10 ?"{shift+clr/home}warm Regards"
20 fOi=1to18:?:nE:fOi=1to20:?" ";:nE
20 ?"CEEJAY"
40 ?:?"Re-coded by another Commodore 64":a$="Sailor Teddy Bear"
50 ?"Personal Computer enthusiast,"
60 fOx=1to22:fOi=1tox:?" ";:nEi
70 ?a$:?"{up-arrow}";:fOd=1to100:nEd:nEx
80 fOx=21to1step-1:fOi=1tox:?" ";:nEi
90 ?a$;" ":?"{up-arrow}";:fOd=1to100:nEd:nEx:gO60
(I forgot how to change from UC/graphics to LC/UC mode.) Verified to
work even in Win64. Compressed CBM Basic code is such a beautiful work
of art...
Wow! The difference between writing C64 Basic and Vizhul Basic: C=
programs work right on the first try, while Win programs never work
right. ('Course, this comes from a die-hard Geos 2.0-64 user. No GPF's
here...)
BTW, the quick and dirty way to do a locate in CBM Basic is as follows:
PRINT "{clr/home}{down-arrows x times}{right-arrows y times}";
(Always use right-arrows because spaces erase.) It never takes more
than 72 characters, plus the program line number, so it stays legal.
Yeah, way OT, but like the subj. says: C64 PC's rule!
_
_.-' )---------------------------------------------------------------\
(_ . '\ __ "It is astonishing, really, how many thoroughly mature, ]
\__^/` _) well-adjusted grown-ups harbor a teddy bear -- which is ]
.-'_ \ perhaps *why* they are thoroughly mature and well- ]
(_.' \ '--. adjusted." -Joseph Lempa, American writer ]
/_ /`-._/ ]
jgs (__/-------Sailor Teddy Bear---sailorteddy(AT)nethere.com----------/
"Dr. Aldo Medina" wrote:
>
> mmmh. C64 doesn't have a locate instruction (and uses x$ variables for
> strings)
>
> "KIESEYHOW (K-man)" wrote:
> >
> > ROFLOL
> >
> > 5 x="warm Regards"
> > 7 locate 20, 40
> > 10 PRINT x
> > 20 PRINT "CEEJAY"
> > 30 GOTO 10
> > 40 END
> >
> > something like that anyway....LOL
> >
> > "Christian 'CeeJay' Jensen" <new...@CeeJay.cjb.nOt> wrote in message
> > news:96r4da$lfn$1...@news.inet.tele.dk...
> > > >10 PRINT WARM REGARDS
> > > >20 PRINT CEEJAY
> > > RUN
> > >
> > > ?SYNTAX ERROR IN 10
> > > READY.
> > >
> > > .. ;-)
> >
> > Ok ..
> >
> > 10 ? "WARM REGARDS"
> > 20 ? "CEEJAY"
> > RUN
Hi! :) I'm a signature virus! Why don't you copy me into your sig file!
I stand justly and truly corrected...*grin*
I admit I was too lazy and I figured no-one cared
if I was correct anyhow...LOL!! Cool, see you never
know who is lurking out there.
--
With reasonable voice,
Kieseyhow (K-man)
A handy trick, to avoid your friends becoming the target of a Spammer's email
scanner, is to fill in their email address into the 'Bcc' field of your email
client. Effectively limiting most Spam email scanners. Also, this prevents
casual noting of private addresses, and the infamous 'Reply to all' messages
that we all dislike.
Nothing in the world is more dangerous, than sincere ignorance and conscientious
stupidity. Martin Luther King, Jr. (1929-68), civil rights leader. Strength to
Love , pt. 4, ch. 3 (1963).
My ICQ#:22448421 Get ICQ for yourself at www.icq.com\download\
----------------------------------------------------------------------
"Sailor Teddy Bear" <sai...@nothere.com> wrote in message
news:3AA...@nothere.com...
Throw in a lurker's two cents:
10 ?"{shift+clr/home}warm Regards"
20 fOi=1to18:?:nE:fOi=1to20:?" ";:nE
20 ?"CEEJAY"
40 ?:?"Re-coded by another Commodore 64":a$="Sailor Teddy Bear"
50 ?"Personal Computer enthusiast,"
60 fOx=1to22:fOi=1tox:?" ";:nEi
70 ?a$:?"{up-arrow}";:fOd=1to100:nEd:nEx
80 fOx=21to1step-1:fOi=1tox:?" ";:nEi
90 ?a$;" ":?"{up-arrow}";:fOd=1to100:nEd:nEx:gO60
(I forgot how to change from UC/graphics to LC/UC mode.) Verified to
work even in Win64. Compressed CBM Basic code is such a beautiful work
of art...
Wow! The difference between writing C64 Basic and Vizhul Basic: C=
programs work right on the first try, while Win programs never work
right. ('Course, this comes from a die-hard Geos 2.0-64 user. No GPF's
here...)
BTW, the quick and dirty way to do a locate in CBM Basic is as follows:
PRINT "{clr/home}{down-arrows x times}{right-arrows y times}";
(Always use right-arrows because spaces erase.) It never takes more
than 72 characters, plus the program line number, so it stays legal.
Yeah, way OT, but like the subj. says: C64 PC's rule!
_
_.-' )---------------------------------------------------------------\
(_ . '\ __ "It is astonishing, really, how many thoroughly mature, ]
\__^/` _) well-adjusted grown-ups harbor a teddy bear -- which is ]
.-'_ \ perhaps *why* they are thoroughly mature and well- ]
(_.' \ '--. adjusted." -Joseph Lempa, American writer ]
/_ /`-._/ ]
jgs (__/-------Sailor Teddy Bear---sailorteddy(AT)nethere.com----------/
"Dr. Aldo Medina" wrote:
>
> mmmh. C64 doesn't have a locate instruction (and uses x$ variables for
> strings)
>
> "KIESEYHOW (K-man)" wrote:
> >
> > ROFLOL
> >
> > 5 x="warm Regards"
> > 7 locate 20, 40
> > 10 PRINT x
> > 20 PRINT "CEEJAY"
> > 30 GOTO 10
> > 40 END
> >
> > something like that anyway....LOL
> >
> > "Christian 'CeeJay' Jensen" <new...@CeeJay.cjb.nOt> wrote in message
> > news:96r4da$lfn$1...@news.inet.tele.dk...
> > > >10 PRINT WARM REGARDS
> > > >20 PRINT CEEJAY
> > > RUN
> > >
> > > ?SYNTAX ERROR IN 10
> > > READY.
> > >
> > > .. ;-)
> >
> > Ok ..
> >
> > 10 ? "WARM REGARDS"
> > 20 ? "CEEJAY"
> > RUN
Hi! :) I'm a signature virus! Why don't you copy me into your sig file!
"KIESEYHOW (K-man)" wrote: > > I stand justly and truly corrected...*grin* > I admit I was too lazy and I figured no-one cared > if I was correct anyhow...LOL!! Cool, see you never > know who is lurking out there. > > -- > > With reasonable voice, > Kieseyhow (K-man) > > A handy trick, to avoid your friends becoming the target of a Spammer's email > scanner, is to fill in their email address into the 'Bcc' field of your email > client. Effectively limiting most Spam email scanners. Also, this prevents > casual noting of private addresses, and the infamous 'Reply to all' messages > that we all dislike. > > Nothing in the world is more dangerous, than sincere ignorance and conscientious > stupidity. Martin Luther King, Jr. (1929-68), civil rights leader. Strength to > Love , pt. 4, ch. 3 (1963). > > My ICQ#:22448421 Get ICQ for yourself at www.icq.com\download\ > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > "Sailor Teddy Bear" <sai...@nothere.com> wrote in message > news:3AA...@nothere.com... > Throw in a lurker's two cents: > > 10 ?"{shift+clr/home}warm Regards" > 20 fOi=1to18:?:nE:fOi=1to20:?" ";:nE > 20 ?"CEEJAY" > 40 ?:?"Re-coded by another Commodore 64":a$="Sailor Teddy Bear" > 50 ?"Personal Computer enthusiast," > 60 fOx=1to22:fOi=1tox:?" ";:nEi > 70 ?a$:?"{up-arrow}";:fOd=1to100:nEd:nEx > 80 fOx=21to1step-1:fOi=1tox:?" ";:nEi > 90 ?a$;" ":?"{up-arrow}";:fOd=1to100:nEd:nEx:gO60 > > (I forgot how to change from UC/graphics to LC/UC mode.) Verified to > work even in Win64. Compressed CBM Basic code is such a beautiful work > of art... ?chr$(14) and ?chr$(142) > Wow! The difference between writing C64 Basic and Vizhul Basic: C= > programs work right on the first try, while Win programs never work > right. ('Course, this comes from a die-hard Geos 2.0-64 user. No GPF's > here...) > > BTW, the quick and dirty way to do a locate in CBM Basic is as follows: > > PRINT "{clr/home}{down-arrows x times}{right-arrows y times}"; > > (Always use right-arrows because spaces erase.) It never takes more > than 72 characters, plus the program line number, so it stays legal. > Yeah, way OT, but like the subj. says: C64 PC's rule! > _ > _.-' )---------------------------------------------------------------\ > (_ . '\ __ "It is astonishing, really, how many thoroughly mature, ] > \__^/` _) well-adjusted grown-ups harbor a teddy bear -- which is ] > .-'_ \ perhaps *why* they are thoroughly mature and well- ] > (_.' \ '--. adjusted." -Joseph Lempa, American writer ] > /_ /`-._/ ] > jgs (__/-------Sailor Teddy Bear---sailorteddy(AT)nethere.com----------/ > > "Dr. Aldo Medina" wrote: > > > > mmmh. C64 doesn't have a locate instruction (and uses x$ variables for > > strings) > > > > "KIESEYHOW (K-man)" wrote: > > > > > > ROFLOL > > > > > > 5 x="warm Regards" > > > 7 locate 20, 40 > > > 10 PRINT x > > > 20 PRINT "CEEJAY" > > > 30 GOTO 10 > > > 40 END > > > > > > something like that anyway....LOL > > > > > > "Christian 'CeeJay' Jensen" <new...@CeeJay.cjb.nOt> wrote in message > > > news:96r4da$lfn$1...@news.inet.tele.dk... > > > > >10 PRINT WARM REGARDS > > > > >20 PRINT CEEJAY > > > > RUN > > > > > > > > ?SYNTAX ERROR IN 10 > > > > READY. > > > > > > > > .. ;-) > > > > > > Ok .. > > > > > > 10 ? "WARM REGARDS" > > > 20 ? "CEEJAY" > > > RUN > > Hi! :) I'm a signature virus! Why don't you copy me into your sig file!
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