Re: Joris and Sandra 3

ppu...@chello.balls.nl (Donderfliegen) writes:

> On 08 Dec 2001 17:46:00 +0100, Neil Franklin <nei...@franklin.ch.remove>
> provoked the following text:
>
> >URN
> >     Uniform Resource Name.
> >        1.An URI that has an institutional commitment to persistence,
> >          availability, etc. Note that this sort of URI may also be a
> >          URL. See, for example, PURLs.
> >        2.A particular scheme, urn:, specified by RFC2141 and related
> >          documents, intended to serve as persistent, location-independent,
> >          resource identifiers.
> >------------------------
> >
> >I doubt strongly, that Donderfliegen will be satisfied with an URN, as
> >any normal publicly used browser can not use them. So he really needs
> >an URL.
>
> Makes me wonder what an URN would look like...

I have never seen an example. I do not think it is defined, apart from
the urn: beginning being reserved for them.


> If i understand correctly, an
> IP address is an URN too, or am i way off here?

AFAIK IP addresses (and anything else physical) make an URI exactly
non-URN-able.

Todays URLs are essentially IP address or hostname and then something
local. So they can get broken when a document changes server (say
because you move webspace provider), or of it changes place in your
sites directory hierarchy. The "fix" used today is to have an
per-institution (that can be an individual author) something.domain
sitename as DNS CNAME that points to the current host. And then
inside the sites hierarchy not move the documents.

That is why I as private person have my own domain franklin.ch,
because I can only so ensure my URLs to stay intact. My first website
was an classic www.provider.dom/neil.franklin and all URLs failled
when I had to change due to the provider folding up. And no redirects
for obvious reasons (server gone). I learned and got a domain.


URNs were intended as an different method of server/space-independant
document ID numbers, a bit like the "library of congress" IDs to
reference a document. Needless to say this turned out to be
complicated to implement (it most likely needs an entire distributed
database into which documents must be "checked in"). So not
surprisingly it never took place (or at least never became publically
known). The "fix" was good enough and immediately available.

The nearest things to URNs I know are the Freenet document IDs, and
they are a bugger to use. Plus the entire Freenet sydtem is unreliable.


So todays browsers are most likely not even URN capable. So URI simply
becomes technodazzle for intellectuals to use to make themselves sound
better informed. Real web users though need URLs, and should demand such.


--
Neil Franklin, nei...@franklin.ch.remove http://neil.franklin.ch/
Hacker, Unix Guru, El Eng HTL/BSc, Sysadmin, Archer, Roleplayer
- Intellectual Property is Intellectual Robbery