Re: SPAMMINGS: ARGH!

Lars Hansen   > ("LarsHansen<"@.) wrote:
>Colin Douthwaite wrote:
>> 
>> Hmm...cancelling your own articles is one thing...cancelling anyone
>> else's articles can cause you to have your account terminated by
>> your access provider(s).

>I believe not, as long as the articles I cancel can surely be defined as
>spam. The official Usenet FAQ's even encourage people to cancel spam, so
>I see no problem in that.

That all depends on your Access Provider's decision if they get 
contacted privately by people objecting to your cancels. 

Usually Access Providers issue a warning to the user before their
account is terminated.  


> Articles that can surely be defined as Spam includes "$$$Make 
> money fast$$$" and "Free Sex passwords".  
>
> If YOU can find a way to defend those kind of articles, let me know.  

I don't defend them but I don't do Third Party Cancels either.


>> > I can't speak for other people, but if people decide to leave this
>> > NG unmoderated, okay, fine with me ... but I will be out of here
>> > for sure!
>>
>> But...you've only just arrived here in alt.ascii-art which has been
>> in successful existence since September 1993 !

> Yes, true. I can only speak for myself, of course. But I'm sure 
> that I'm not the only one bothered so much about the spam that I 
> would consider simply leaving.  

Also true...but when are you going to post some ascii pictures here 
instead of anti-spam messages ?  Or did I miss your pictures ?  *8-)

There are plenty of newsgroups specifically for anti-spamming 
activities...try...  

         news.admin.announce 
         news.admin.net-abuse.bulletins
         news.admin.net-abuse.email
         news.admin.net-abuse.policy
         news.admin.net-abuse.sightings
         news.admin.net-abuse.usenet


> I think it would be a shame that all you talented Ascii 
> graphicians would have to live with all that crap. The way I see 
> it, a NG where spam commercials can live and grow is just as bad 
> as a NG moderated too hard.  

So...you are here to save us rather than post ascii pictures ?  *8-)

If you are really committed to the Anti-spam cause then why not get 
involved in the appropriate newsgroups ?  ( see list above ).


> Think back on how much spam there was 2 weeks ago. Then think back 
> on 2 months ago. The number of spam posts have really increased. 
> Am I right?  

The big increase in Spam in _all_ newsgroups was/is due to 
a deliberate Moratorium by Anti-spammers for a number of days to 
demonstrate how much newsgroup spam they were actually killing. 

Someone already posted an article here on 13 July in this thread
explaining the Moratorium. Did you miss that posting ?


> But I'm not the person in charge here, if I (+ two more I know of) 
> are the only ones in favor of cancelling spam, I'll stop right away. 
> The decition of what to do with spam should be taken by the 
> majority, not by me.  

Nope...the decision to cancel is entirely yours and any consequences 
of your actions mst fall entirely on you. No one asked you to do
cancellations here...one or two people have asked you to stop.  

No one is in-charge of alt.ascii-art...it is a free and unmoderated 
newsgroup where everyone can post whatever they wish...and...other 
users react accordingly.  


>> A Moderated newsgroup for ascii-art already exists in
>> "rec.arts.ascii". Created in 1994 it has already been abandoned 
>> by two lots of Moderators.  

>> Result ?  The newsgroup has become empty and derelict. That's
>> _exactly_ what happens to a moderated newsgroup when moderators leave
>> or do not do the job efficiently...moderation is no easy task, is
>> unpaid, and thankless...no wonder moderators often walk away !

> Are you sure that the moderators leaving was the one and only 
> reason that the newsgroup is now empty? I'm sorry, but I really 
> don't understand that. You mean like, the graphicians became so 
> dependant of the moderators that they couldn't bear to see them leave?  

In a moderated newsgroup all articles are, in effect, emailed to the 
Moderator who then decides whether the articles get posted to the 
newsgroup or rejected. The moderator is not even obliged to inform 
posters that their articles have been rejected...some do, some don't.  

If the moderator leaves there is nobody to receive or post the 
articles anymore so the group becomes empty very quickly and dies.
The group's users can do nothing about it.

Once appointed Moderators have total control of the newsgroup and 
cannot be removed against their will. There is no mechanism for 
removing a moderator no matter how bad the performance. 


> I'm sure something happened .... hmm 'did not do the job 
> effeciently'?  What do you mean?  

Efficient moderators ensure there is minimum delay in approving 
articles and posting all approved articles to the newsgroup. This 
needs a reliable Net Access Provider and the moderator's personal 
diligence in clearing articles submitted to the moderator on a daily basis.  

Sometimes a moderator's Access Site has problems and the articles 
are delayed or do not reach the moderator. 

A moderator's performance and efficiency cannot be predicted.

What seems to have happened with rec.arts.ascii is that the first 
Moderator's enthusiasm ( Bob Allison ) burnt out so he handed the 
newsgroup over to Don Bertino who was unsuccessful in trying to 
maintain the group's activity and therefore gave up the job without 
finding a successor...thereby leaving the group to become empty and 
derelict.  

If someone wishes to try again to revive "rec.arts.ascii" 
(moderated) they can volunteer to be moderators but they will need 
to attract people to post their artwork there and they will need a
reliable site and account to operate successfully.  


For historical interest: 
( How many of the 453 YES voters remain ? )

==================  Excerpt from rec.arts.ascii vote  ===============

Subject: RESULT: rec.arts.ascii moderated passes 453:74
Date: 31 May 1994 15:54:46 -0400

                              RESULTS
              moderated group rec.arts.ascii passes 453:74

There were 453 YES votes and 74 NO votes, for a total of 527 valid 
votes. There were 2 abstains and 12 invalid ballots. 

[...snip...]

   o  The existing groups alt.ascii-art and 
      alt.binaries.pictures.ascii have served well as proving 
      grounds and attest to the usefulness and popularity of this 
      form of graphics and art.  It is time for rec.arts.ascii to 
      better serve Net users.  

[...snip...]

The main purpose of the moderator is to handle the constant flow of 
frequently asked questions (despite the FAQ posted weekly).  This 
need would be even greater with the estimated increase in traffic 
for rec.arts.ascii over the existing alt groups.  The moderator 
would send a FAQ to posters of frequently asked questions, and also 
redirect the posters of inappropriate items to the proper groups. 

====================================================================


In the meantime...


   .
  /:\
  |:|
  |:|
  |:|                              *_   _   _   _   _   _   _   *
  |:|      __                      | `_' `-' `_' `-' `_' `-' `_'|
,_|:|_,   /  )                     |                            |        
  (Oo    / _I_                     |  LONG LIVE  alt.ascii-art  |        
   +\ \  || __|            ^       |                            |       ^
      \ \||___|            |       |     Free & Unmoderated     |       |
        \ /.:.\-\          |  (*)  |_   _   _   _   _   _   _   |  \^/  |
         |.:. /-----\      | _<">_ | `_' `-' `_' `-' `_' `-' `_'| _(#)_ |
         |___|  oOo  |    o+o \a/ \0                            0/ \a/ (=)
         /   |<a.a-a>|     0'\a-a/\/                            \/\a-a/`0
        |_____\  :  /        /_^_\ |                            | /_^_\
         | |  \ \:/          || || |                            | || ||
         | |   | |           d|_|b_T____________________________T_d|_|b
         \ /   | \___              /                           /
         / |   \_____\           /                            /
         `-'                   /                             /  -cfbd-
____________________________ /                              /___________


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