Re: ASCII Art Fart for Thu, 2004 Nov 25

In <41A...@yahoo.com>, ABCGi wrote:

>Sharky wrote:
>
>> In <41a...@dnews.tpgi.com.au>, ABCGi wrote:
>> 
>>>Sharky wrote:
>>>
>>>>In <41ad71cd$1...@dnews.tpgi.com.au>, ABCGi wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>>The facts are that all the unjustified homicides committed in the USA are
>>>>>>committed in violation of some law. More importantly, the vast majority of
>>>>>>these unjustified homicides are committed by people who are in possession
>>>>>>of arms that have been attained illegally and committed against unarmed,
>>>>>>law abiding citizens. You can compare the "murder" rate in the USA with
>>>>>>places that doctor their statistics all you want, the meat is in the
>>>>>>overall death rate of a country's citizens - you might want to dig a little
>>>>>>deeper on that topic.
>>>>>
>>>>>Sharky I doubt this is true, do you have some stats? 
>>>>
>>>>Damn! I hate it when people doubt my veracity and THEN ask ME for
>>>>information that they have already been prejudged. ;)
>>>>
>>>>Check out http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/ and look
>>>>at the death rates for the UK, france, Germany, Russia... etc.
>>>>
>>>>Where it is true that the death rate for Australia and Canada are lower
>>>>than the USA, the USA comes in below the worlds average for the number of
>>>>deaths per 1000 persons.  However, there are other socioeconomic factors
>>>>(such as over-crowding) that effect the statistical models for violent
>>>>crime. 
>>>
>>>Hmmm, well I didn't prejudge. I saw stats on gun deaths. Its an 
>>>interesting site, but those stats are for all deaths - so that is not as 
>>>useful. However the overall death rate is not too staggering, but that 
>>>could be for any number of reasons;
>> 
>> You seem preoccupied with the idea that death by a "gun" is somewhat more
>> important than any other form of death. If you want to approach the problem
>> logically you're going to have to consider all manners of death - that is
>> if the object of the exploration of the subject is to find a positive
>> solutions.
>
>This is a classicly specious/spurious. Take a specific problem and then 
>generalise it to a larger and more difficult to solve problem, or in 
>other cases take an example to extremes in order to attempt to 
>invalidate it.

I am in no way invalidating deaths by firearms in the overall death rate.
Your unrealistic assumption that an inanimate object can be the cause of
death is narrow minded, IMO.

>Gun deaths form a disproportionately high factor of violence in the USA 
>(from what I have seen) and so is an excellent area to focus on in order 
>to reduce violence. It seems, based on the death rates you showed me, 
>that the USA must be doing something else right in terms of death. But 
>that doesn't stop gun deaths being a legitimate problem in its own right.

And what would you propose to solve the problem of gun related crime?
Should the people of the USA give up the freedom to arm themselves with
weapons of self defense, like so many Kingdoms of this world?

If yes, there's an old saying here in America that goes something like
this "Suck my big fat choad, you fascist fuck"...or something like that.


>>>http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/factbook/
>>>
>>>US 8.34 deaths/1,000 population (2004 est.)
>>>Aus  7.38 deaths/1,000 population (2004 est.)
>> 
>>>>If you're not familiar with the subject, you might be interested in the
>>>>theory that man, as a primate, is far more prone to violence when herded
>>>>into dense groups, with other primates.  It is only a theory when applied
>>>>towards man, though.
>>>
>>>Although there are countries that share these conditions but do not 
>>>exactly share the same level of violence, so clearly a lot more factors 
>>>are involved.
>> 
>> As a tribute to your heroic defense of women's right at the start of this
>> thread, I offer you the following quote:
>> 
>> "European police met in The Hague to look at ways of tackling the rising
>> phenomenon of "honour killings".  They aim to set up a pan-European unit to
>> combat the killings and crack down on related issues such as trafficking. 
>> 
>> Police are re-opening murder files related to families of Turkish, Middle
>> Eastern, Asian, Arabic and Eastern European origin over the past 10 years.
>> Many victims of "honour killings" are women involved in relationships their
>> family felt brought dishonour on them. I think we've been unaware, we've
>> been ignorant of the crimes going on, said Andy Baker, a UK police
>> commander. 
>> 
>> Experts say such killings are on the rise in Europe, but as the issue
>> remains largely hidden from public view, exact numbers are unknown. A
>> 26-year-old Kurd, Fadime was shot dead two years ago near Stockholm,
>> allegedly by her father because of her relationship with a Swedish man. The
>> murder triggered calls for urgent action to protect young immigrants who
>> fall out with their families."
>> http://www.rowzane.com/000_etelayeha/2407/240718-Bulletin%2026.htm
>> 
>> Clearly there are some discrepancies in the violent crime rate towards
>> women being reported by a number of countries, eh?  What does that say
>> about the overall credibility of the crime rates published by said
>> countries?  You have to wonder.
>
>I'd have to agree. Your quote also points out that violence against 
>women (particularily sexual assault) is a pandemic that crosses borders 
>and cultures.
>
>The stats I used were recently published for NSW, Australia, were 
>official govt. stats and were also quite conservative. Its enough to 
>show that there is a problem, that it's not right, and our 
>system/cultures are not doing enough to combat it. However a judge here 
>is kicking up a stink about improving the prosecution of sexual assault 
>and I see other positive signs (like the day of stopping violence 
>against women).

>> ObAscii: Lebonease Divorce
>> 
>>                    .   ((),).  .
>>                  (    ))) 6(6      )
>>                    . ((c` _e/   ( .
>>                 , )  )))'(         )
>>              ) ) ( .((( , \    ,. (' )  )
>>               ( .    )\ \ _o___,-.  '  .
>>           (    ), ) ( )\.__,-._\ (   ',    )
>>            .' ) ( .  / -/   \ |(    )   ( .
>>         ). , ( .   ((      /_)\ \' (  ,    )
>>        (_,) . ), ) _ '.__,'  \_\ '. )  ,. (' )
>>    jgs^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^joris
>
>I saw a shocking story on a woman who was cut up by her semi-deranged 
>husband for talking to another man inside their house (a cousin I 
>think). She had her nose, ears and I think lips cut off. To do such a 
>think you'd have to consider the woman less than human. The documentary 
>showed her sent to the States for incredible plastic surgery which was 
>done gratis by the doctor.

Well, thank fuck they didn't use a gun on the poor woman!

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